by Rennie on Tue Mar 02, 2004 12:28 pm
Ok, quickly, as I don't want to waste my time with you, I will run through your either idiotic or plain stupid parts of your post which annoyed me.
[s]Unregisted User phil reid wrote on 11:02, 25th Feb 2004:
1. Surely entirely unneccessary as their not actually very complicated. turn up on the day and ask. guests must be in by 11 and signed in for the weekend by 4.45. - It is complicated to the 40 or so students I personally turn away (I also work as Door Security) every week because they didn't know these rules. Maybe because you worked there for a year you have a better grasp of them than most?
also a sign would actually need planning permission - what, for a sign on the inside of the glass? I don't think so.
2. A rope barrier would narrow the corridor, which is a fire route, and lower the capacity of the building. strange but true - Balls. This gets said every time this idea is suggested., The union has never once been full to capacity on the last year and a half so this isn't a problem and the corridor would be widened if anything as the people lining up would be in single file, allowing more space for others to pass. Simple logic.
3. Paint would look tacky and scruffy very quickly. a carpet might be nicer but would need to be shampooed on friday and saturday mornings, and would not have time to dry, leaving a smell such as can be found in the mardi gras. Probably best to think of them as industrial, oh, and that aint no plywood - Heard of re-painting? It's also relatively simple and cheap, especially if you get your own staff to do it (which I have seen on many occasions) I also don't think carpet would be a good idea but it was never suggested.
4. Definately get rid of the green, but a graffitti artist would want slightly more than you expect, and again it would look tacky extremely quickly. Matt black drapes were always the plan, but theres always something more important to do than measure the seating blocks and order DFR black drapes. - Something tackier than large green plastic sheeting? Is that possible? There's always something more important to do, like eating at beatons for 2 hours a day? Or generally arsing about? Ok, now I see your point.
5. Whilst I see the point of people wanting to stay out until it is busy, frankly its a students union not a club, (you can tell by the way not everyone has knives), and you shouldn't be denying students the knowledge of what its like inside. make the events better people, dont trick people into going in - I agree.
6. as i say above, dont give free access, spend money making the event better, also with the regard to the discussion on free drink, when the union does give out free alcohol the supplier, i.e. guiness or aftershock actually buy it from the union, they don't give it to the union, so it makes as much as if the students had bought it - Maybe if we negotiated more agreements like this, than we would be able to run the offers that seem popular (I remember a free tennants offer in Venue 1 being very successful). You never actually say whether free drink is a good idea or not, personally I think it is.
and on the fundamental problem that you percieve it isn't the lack of proffessionality, it is the failure to give off an air of proffessionality. There's a big difference - They are one and the same to the paying customers who only see the "lack of an air of professionality" (as you put it), and the Union itself to me looks more unprofessional than any I have been in throughout the country, and many of them have the same number of students as St Andrews - so probably similar budgets as well, they just don't hoard it all in the bank.
on the subject of prices and beers the prices in the union are still incredibly close to what they were when I arrived in 1998, inspite of higher transport costs, minimum wage, and duty on alcopops. the reason they have stayed down was northern services moving to a single supplier for brewed products in 2002 when many new taxes came in, and at the time tennents tendered a lower bid than any of the other suppliers - Prices have increased from £1.20 a pint to £1.50 a pint for the cheapest one over 2 1/2 years. This is not in line with inflation, and is an increase of 25% on the original price. (someone tell me if I have the maths wrong) As this is the main drink for the customers in the Union then they have been unfairly hit by large increases for profiteering (in my view). Although, the Union does have much cheaper drinks than the rest of town generally, there are some nights when other pubs beat them (Boozeday Tuesday in the Vic for one)
on the issue of beatons it cannot be the cheapest place in st andrews, as it can never be cheaper than a pasta 'n' source from tesco's. - Irrelevant point, we're clearly talking about food you don't have to cook yourself, that's one of the main points of eating out. That's an idiotic statement if ever I saw one.
it is a union department, and whilst you may say 'a macdonalds in the union would make a fortune' you should also ask ' why doesn't one open in st andrews anyway?' the reason is st andrews is st andrews has only 15000 residents, and you can't eat a maccy d that often. the franchise costs a fortune, and the union would pay for it all year, even when shut.
Beatons's problem is lack of investment, and I will cover this issue below - McDonalds are desperate to open an outlet in St Andrews, as can be seen by the refulsals of the owner of PM's when it goes to the relevant council boards. You can't eat a McD's that often? Tell that to the 20% of American kids who eat one every day. Get your facts straight. Why would we pay for the franchise?? McD's pay for the rent of the space, and the exclusive licence of selling food in teh union. They would also avoid planning permission going down this road (I assume). They would jump at the chance to have a franchise in the union, but I don't think this is a good idea, not healthy, not an ethical company blah blah.
on the topflight club manager i've no doubt that if you replaced campbell dave sandy and the sabs oyu could afford one, but then you'd need to re-appoint a bar manager, a deputy manager, a maintenance manager and someone to oversee the other departments. Mardi-Gras has 5 managers of different types, to open for less than 50 hours week. - If you replaced all those people, you would probably be saving £130,000 a year (Rough estimates). I think this could get you more than one manager. Do the maths.
on external projectors ones to cover that kind of a distance with that level of background light and at such a sharp angle, you would be looking at £10000s - Not true at all. If they were set up correctly, from overhanging temporary brackets (so no planning permission is needed) then they could be positioned close to the union wall, solving ther problem of dispersion. A projector could then be bought for about £3,000 for a good model, cheaper for worse. Again, do the maths.
on gigs there have been,as others have said, many many gigs, but when people say we want up and coming bands, they either mean i want a band i know who no one else will go to see or we want the darkness. just look at snow patrol, now a major band, 6 months ago a crowd of a few hundred in freshers week and major haemorraging of money - Gigs, this never seems to work. Maybe advertising is the problem? As I have little interest in live music, I'm not sure how to make this area better, so I'll leave it to someone better than me to think of ideas.
and the last set of points are from the incredibly poorly informed. if he has served a year as an officer he has made absolutely no attempt to look at how the organisation works, done no research and is seriously lacking in common sense. - The position of Trading Officer is a redundant position. This has been noted in the Working Party's discussions. Therefore, there isn't much I can actually do for my role. A gopher for the sabs is not something I am willing to do, they get paid for their jobs remember.
on the point of what students want he appears entirely unaware that the union regularly pulls in more students than the west port, broons and the gin house combined. remember the place is massive, 2000 capacity, and on a bad weeknight there are maybe 150 people in the bar, and on a thursday 500, on friday 1500 and on a saturday 1000, and these are the low figures. - Your figures are incorrect. I know this, as again I make the point that everyone going in goes past me. Your figures are for good busy nights, and the Saturday figure is not right on any night. You must also remember that a lot of people do not stay in the union for very long, and some just pass through looking for friends.
if an impartial observer were asked what the busiest place in st andrews is, there is only one which can regularly claim p to a 1/4 of the student populace. - It is a massive venue, the biggest in St Andrews with the latest licence on a Friday. We should be drawing in more than 1/4 of all students (not that I think 1/4 are 'drawn in') anyway, at least at some point in the night.
on the survey if it's your job - It isn't my job as Trading Officer why did the sabs have to stand other to ensure you did it. - That doesn't make senes and I can't even decipher it. also have you set up anyform of committee or working group to analyse the results you recieved, or is it your considered opinion that it students haven't been 'lost' all the union needs lost people don't go to a bar and stay for 4 years. - The results haven't been collated yet, and this isn't my responsibility, so I don't know. I helped set it up, and got people to fill it in for the day. This, I feel, is a fair share of the workload to a non-paid, irrelevant, officer.
individual offers and an envigorated program will bring them back - This is a true point. Are you trying to be sarcastic?
the note of yours on the projectors and lighting rigs shows an alarming ignorance. the union has 2 video projectors, one bought 6 years, and one swapped for 4 broken lights in the summer which the insurer had written off, so the union is actually not depreciating any projectors. on the lighting rig the union has spent aout £30 000 - £40000 on fabric and lighting in venue 1 since 2000, less than £10 000 a year, and all needed if you compare the place I came to to the venue you have now. - I don't know exact figures, all I know is that a large amount of money gets spent on lighting each year and it is rarely all used at once. This seems to be wasting money on something which is already good enough for the job, concentrate on getting people in there to actually see the lights etc..
...in that time ents has generated over £400 000 in revenue, approaching double what in did in the four years beforehand. - I doubt this figure strongly, but I have no figures to go off myself. £400,000 seems a lot to me, I can't see where all that money would come from? Student plays? Occasional renting? are you taking into account overheads?
really do do your homework before you mouth off. - The pot calling the kettle black?
On the subject of maintenance do you realise how much the union already spends on that? the problems are firstly holding onto staff to work 6-9 every morning, and the tiny window for work. the building opens it's doors at 6 and the public comes in at 9, meaning there is no poortunity for repainting or signifiant works except in the holidays. - It isn't even done in the holidays, extensive maintainence was being carried out through Freshers Week, the busiest week of the year for the Union, the time when you are supposed to impress the students. Maintainence can be carried out in quiet afternoon periods, I have seen re-painting happen at these times, why not the minor cosmetic changes that need doing?
....it is also tied to university maintnenance contracts, and university contractors will always go to them insstead of us (it is a uni building so this will never change) - Possibly. I don;t know the specifics of contracts and so on.
finally on the point of the union management freeing funds. that would be you you halfwit. - WHAT? Why would I have control of these funds? What are you on about you idiot?
...of couse money is available, over 1 million pounds, but it has to be spent on projects where it will be made back, that being basic financial logic - Obviously. Then why have no proposals been made to make major changes since I have been here? Why has teh union got steadily worse, and more expensive? Why can get nicer food somewhere else in town for a lot less money? Because the Union management are inefficient, like so many departments within this University. There are people there who really do try, but with the limited resources, it is no wonder that they give up.
(mind you it is basic so thatmay of escaped you). - Thanks for the random insult. Have one back. Prick
now having answered those points i'll make my own summary. the main problem for the union is the hard working senior officials get completely exhausted dealing with trivia. after the 10th straight 5 hour SRC meeting discussing its only topic, restructuring, - Yes, I completely agree. Insomniacs, I recommend Union meetings to cure any conditions you may have.
you're not at your best the next morning. equally hours spent on disciplinary appeals because people feel they have the right to vandalise the premises or be violent towards staff and students does the same to your enthusiasm - Or, trying to ban someone for assaulting you the night before, only then having to let the same person in the next night because of disiplinary proceedurtes taking place, and the lack of strict policy on this subject.. The Deputy Building Manager's common sense approach is extremely useful on those occasions.
...as does having someone winge at you for 2 hours in your office, then in the saint then on the sinner because there physicaly isn't space for their booking. this isn't an excuse, as sabs are paid to do it, but there are only so many hours in the day, and the junior officers, such as mr rennie, are often to busy trying to make themselves look good by criticising to buck their chances for re-election - Re-election??? Why would I want to do that? I ran first time to see what the inner workings of the Union were like, I wouldn't want to go back there.
to do any significant work on actually making the place better. - Hmm, I doubt that. Very much so. If the sabs wanted to make the place better, they could. They (I think) have to try and push through more ambitious projects and ideas which will lead to real change. However, I don't think they will.
on the lack of investment the problem has been since 2000 the lack of a plan. whilst I have to take some blame for this is does seem the current sabs are creating one, which i cannot download and look at here, it is important this document is more than a wish list and looks at how to finance and implement the changes the strategic plan recommends, as well as a having a review structure - Possibly, again I don't have dealings with this.
enough bitterness, time to get back to earning your money (if you pay taxes), and olly, if you put this on unedited I'll pay you back the money I owe you if I ever go back up there
Phil Reid, VPS 2001-2
So, have I explained myself clearly enough? I certainly wasted enough of my time on you. Maybe if you had done your job properly when you were in office the Union wouldn't have been in a steady decline since you left. Or maybe that's just the way things are.
Alex Rennie
Edited for formatting