What the hell do I do?

[munchingfoo]

Okay - So here's the situation:

I'm working on my SH project report which is due in at 4PM this Friday and I'm trundling along doing my normal mathematical scriblings on a white board when all of a sudden I realised I've disproved a theory created in 1939 by counter example(a pretty sound way of disproving something if it's simple enough so I'm 100% certain of this)

Great you might say - have a 20.

But, alas, no. The issue is that part of my project which has taken me a year to complete relies on this theory, or more to the point the inverse function of this theory.

So - Do I

A) Write down my wonderful findings in my report - completely out of context to the detriment of continuity (also - there's no way in hell I'm gonna make a good job of explaining this before friday)

or do I

B) Pretend I haven't disproved it until Friday at 4PM and then unleash it onto the world. (I'm pretty sure this would be academic fraud)

[hr]

Tired Freudian references aside - your mother played my mighty skin flute like a surf crowned sea nymph trying to rouse Poseidon from his watery slumber!

[Frank]

Hmm. Is it possible to split it? Make a 'Well, I had been doing this...', and use that as the prime example of the work you've been doing, and then follow on with a big 'but look at this'.

Okay, it disproves the arguments, but the logic behind things still stands, perhaps?

On the other hand: Simply stop working on your project. Thus it's *not* academic fraud. Submit it as 'finished', and then begin working on clarifying your new thoughts[the disproof by counter example]. In this scenario, you *can* do all the touch ups and corrections to the original, but without expanding further.

Maybe not though...

[hr]

"There is only ever one truth. Things are always black or white, there's no such thing as a shade of grey. If you think that something is a shade of grey it simply means that you don't fully understand the situation. The truth is narrow and the path of the pursuit of truth is similarly narrow."

[the racing tortoise]

well all your work up to now would have been valid under your initial assumtions (which at the time were reasonable), and as you are presenting it mostly for the grade it would seem sensable to present your work, untrue assumtions and all, with a postscript destroying your assumtion. This is going to make your work almost useless as a research piece (which sucks, though you may be able to salvage somthing), but it shouldn't affect your grade detramentally.

just as a curiosity, what did you disprove?

[hr]

A fish swims into a wall and says "DAM"

[James]

I'd say it was far better to go down as disproving a long-standing theory than to submit a new project, especially when you'd know that, actually, your findings are invalid. Even if you did option B, you'd know that, in the long term, your work would have no use once you show that the premise is false. I know it would screw up your project, but you'll be doing the maths community more of a service by disproving something this theory.

Ask your lecturer / supervisor / tutor whether you can get credit for the project work you've done, even though it's ultimately no use? Can you get something like "error carried forward"? Or else, ask for special dispensation seeing as how, through no fault of your own, you've managed to blow this theory out of the water.

As a maths graduate, that's what I'd have been thinking -- but then I was never quite good enough to do something this good!

I just think there's more glory in disproving a long-standing theory than turning in something new which will turn out to be invalid. It's also more fun, especially when you think that you could be cocking up other people's work that relies on this theory.

[Smith]

serves you right for trying to find pan-dimensional magic squares of the 9th order, really.

[hr]

Cake, and fine wine.

[motorhead]

Quoting munchingfoo from 03:53, 20th Apr 2006
Okay - So here's the situation:

I'm working on my SH project report which is due in at 4PM this Friday and I'm trundling along doing my normal mathematical scriblings on a white board when all of a sudden I realised I've disproved a theory created in 1939 by counter example(a pretty sound way of disproving something if it's simple enough so I'm 100% certain of this)

Great you might say - have a 20.

But, alas, no. The issue is that part of my project which has taken me a year to complete relies on this theory, or more to the point the inverse function of this theory.

So - Do I

A) Write down my wonderful findings in my report - completely out of context to the detriment of continuity (also - there's no way in hell I'm gonna make a good job of explaining this before friday)

or do I

B) Pretend I haven't disproved it until Friday at 4PM and then unleash it onto the world. (I'm pretty sure this would be academic fraud)

[hr]

Tired Freudian references aside - your mother played my mighty skin flute like a surf crowned sea nymph trying to rouse Poseidon from his watery slumber!

Stop showing off Andy

[mike]

Quoting munchingfoo from 03:53, 20th Apr 2006
Okay - So here's the situation:

I'm working on my SH project report which is due in at 4PM this Friday and I'm trundling along doing my normal mathematical scriblings on a white board when all of a sudden I realised I've disproved a theory created in 1939 by counter example(a pretty sound way of disproving something if it's simple enough so I'm 100% certain of this)

Great you might say - have a 20.

But, alas, no. The issue is that part of my project which has taken me a year to complete relies on this theory, or more to the point the inverse function of this theory.

So - Do I

A) Write down my wonderful findings in my report - completely out of context to the detriment of continuity (also - there's no way in hell I'm gonna make a good job of explaining this before friday)

or do I

B) Pretend I haven't disproved it until Friday at 4PM and then unleash it onto the world. (I'm pretty sure this would be academic fraud)

[hr]

Tired Freudian references aside - your mother played my mighty skin flute like a surf crowned sea nymph trying to rouse Poseidon from his watery slumber!

i think the solution to your problem is obvious. all research is based on theories that are disproved or redefined as time goes on - that is the nature of scientific research. thus only the current crop of publications are regarded as 'true' or 'correct' at any one point.

yet the historical publications are not removed from the journals, and are always still referenced. in fact the original theorem was probably the inspriation for your project - it being true or otherwise.

if/when i disprove something the first thing i do is dpeak to my supervisor - and at no point do i consider scrapping the previous 2 years of work in my PhD!

solution: go speak to your supervisor asap, firstly she/he will probably double check your work (perhaps providing an instant solution to your problem). after all, every piece of research is referreed, and is not accepted as true until after this process.

i also expect she/he will suggest leaving this contraversial result out of the final report - perhaps leaving it as future work/summer project.

hope this helps! and good luck (btw what theorem is it anyway?)

[munchingfoo]

Quoting Smith from 09:21, 20th Apr 2006
serves you right for trying to find pan-dimensional magic squares of the 9th order, really.

pan-diagonal of order 7

but yeah - it totally does.

[hr]

Tired Freudian references aside - your mother played my mighty skin flute like a surf crowned sea nymph trying to rouse Poseidon from his watery slumber!

[KateBush]

Include it in an appendix? Don't pretend you haven't found it tho- it's quite clever to have disproved something like that.



[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/vasovagalvegan/
POTS and Vasovagal Syncope- not for the *faint* hearted
See me in my wheelchair? Keep staring--I might do a trick!

[Sid]

I'd laugh if you hadn't actually disproved it. You'd look like a total fool! Ha! And you are showing off, oooooohhh, look at me, I'm the next Pascal, I disproved this theory, what do I do guys? Get a life.

[womble chris]

i wish i was doing your subject.

i remember doing magic squares at primary school, even then i could do them.

[Sid]

Oooooo, must be your time of the month. Take a pill.

Quoting dunqn from 14:27, 20th Apr 2006
Sid, you're the one needlessly posting bitchy comments on other people's threads. He isn't showing off, he's looking for valid opinions on what do do. Haven't you got anything better to do than post snide little remarks all the time on here? How about you 'get a life'.

[Bonnie]

I say finish what you were working on and add a chapter saying, BUT WAIT! I've found something else, and work like hell on what you've just discovered.

You're supposed to think of ways that what you've just done can be disputed and dispute the disputes, right?
Dispute yourself with your own genius.

[hr]

I love cheese.

[lauremw]

Lucky - I'm still waiting for a magic breakthrough in my research that proves my thinking and disproves all the academic squabbling surrounding it. I can only hope.

In any case, double check your work. Have someone else who understands it check for any little errors which might have slipped by. Maybe even a trusted faculty member - before you submit it. If it is all ok, then add it in your discussion at the end and use it to conclude. Or if it really doesn't fit, put it in an appendix. Your research isn't all for nothing as it's still based on an accepted (well until you formally publish, if you choose to do so) theory.

[hr]

~*~*~*~
"And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." ~ Anais Nin

[flarewearer]

Quoting Sid from 15:53, 20th Apr 2006
Oooooo, must be your time of the month. Take a pill.

I'll see If I can convince dunqn to take a pill, but only if you promise to clean the sand out of your vagina.

[hr]

[Grandpa]

Talk to your tutor!

[hr]

We are gentlemen that neither in our hearts nor outward eyes envy the great nor shall the low despise.

[Grandpa]

Talk to your tutor, or whoever it is that marks these things...they will either be able to spot where you've gone wrong or be able to guide you in the correct way forward.

[hr]

We are gentlemen that neither in our hearts nor outward eyes envy the great nor shall the low despise.

[Sid]

Why don't you clean it out!

Quoting flarewearer from 16:46, 20th Apr 2006

Quoting Sid from 15:53, 20th Apr 2006
Oooooo, must be your time of the month. Take a pill.

I'll see If I can convince dunqn to take a pill, but only if you promise to clean the sand out of your vagina.

[hr]

[jennyo]

I don't know about with you scientists, but my general idea of doing research and projects and such is that you're trying to find out if your thesis or premise is true, which it sometimes isn't.

If your entire project was based on a widely accepted theorem, I think the fact that you've proved it false (I assume conclusively or else you wouldn't be bothering to tell us about it) is more important than plodding along finishing your report as if it had never happened. Make it an appendix if you have to, but pretending it never happened would be shortchanging yourself.



[hr]

Do those under a risk of death by metor run some thus-far indefinite risk of longrun meteorisation?
- David Bean

[munchingfoo]

I spoke to my tutor and he has suggested putting a footnote about the counter example(even if it's nearly a pagelong ), sounds good to me.

And Sid? All this because we disagree on abortion - how mature of you. I am all for intellectual debate; if you ever wish to show any intellect I'd be happy to retort. As for now I intend not to trade petty insults..

[hr]

Tired Freudian references aside - your mother played my mighty skin flute like a surf crowned sea nymph trying to rouse Poseidon from his watery slumber!