Exams *before* Christmas

[Frank]

Well, I was thinking about it (not terribly in depth, but still...), and when it comes down to it I feel that we'd probably all be better of with exams before the Christmas break.

With juggling of the semester dates it'd be possible, unless there are very specific stipulations on the finishing of the Martinmas semester such that exams just cannot be fitted in before the break.

So, I'd ask: is there any particular reasonings for and against the before-after thing?

For me it certainly feels like it would be obvious to have them before the break, but I would guess there are reasons to the contrary (hence the present state). My trouble is that I cannot think of them.

What has the history of the exam setup been in St Andrews, was it changed to this way because another was unworkable, perhaps?

Ah well, back to revision.

Frank

[hr]

"There is only ever one truth. Things are always black or white, there's no such thing as a shade of grey. If you think that something is a shade of grey it simply means that you don't fully understand the situation. The truth is narrow and the path of the pursuit of truth is similarly narrow."

[Orcas]

It's done in the US, and my understanding is that the English Uni's also before (correct me if I'm wrong).

I'd go them before instead of having to come back nearly a month later and trying to remember things, especially if it's a language. A month of not speaking it and we're being tested. Do it when it's fresh like the spring exams.

Couldn't we just start earlier in the year?

[hr]

www.sufrasees.blogspot.co,

[novium]

i mean, on the one hand, you have more time to study. In my experience at my university in the states, finals tended to be, at most, worth oh.....40 percent of the class? and that was fairly uncommon...and they were much, much, much easier.

[hr]

tamen ira procul absit, cum qua nihil recte fieri, nihil considerate potest.

[n01]

i think the starting date of our term has something to do with how late people entering the school get results of some tests... (highers... i don't know, i was at school in the states!)

i'd also prefer to have exams before xmas but i brought this up last year and it was shot down quite harshly. thinking about it, i think it's brought up nearly every year.

there must be a reason that they are after xmas...

[Lyeta]

They have exams before xmas here at Edinburgh uni and i much much much prefer the st. andrews way. I will admit it is a bit of a treat to have xmas hols when you dont actually have to do anything work-wise, but i still dont think it balances out the evilness of having exams right at the end of the semester when you are already flaked out/stressed/tired from handing in assignments.

[sat]

A professor emeritus told me that he'd suggested this during the "semesterisation" of the University but it was, in his words, "too radical" at the time.

I think semester and exam dates have to be set quite well in advance, so any changes could only affect, at the quickest, the session a few years down the line.

[WashingtonIrving]

We had a discussion about this in a revision lecture, our lecturer thought having exams after christmas was ridiculous. We came to the conclusion that Brian Lang hates Christmas I think.

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"I said farewell honey, I'll see you Judgment Day"

[Al]

Quoting Frank from 02:17, 13th Jan 2007
What has the history of the exam setup been in St Andrews, was it changed to this way because another was unworkable, perhaps?

Well, before semesterisation - back in the days when the academic year started in October and was divided into three terms - some exams were held at the end of each of the first two terms and in the middle of the third. Back then there were two types of exam: class exams (held each term) and degree exams (held at the end of the year). If a sub-honours student did well enough in their written work and class exams then they could get an "exemption" from sitting their end of year exams.

[pea]

Quoting n01 from 08:09, 13th Jan 2007
i'd also prefer to have exams before xmas but i brought this up last year and it was shot down quite harshly. thinking about it, i think it's brought up nearly every year.

Yep same with me, I remember getting a very hostile reaction and a kind of "Don't be so stupid" attitude when I brought it up too.

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I'm a little pea, I love the sky and the trees...

[The Jaspar]

When I was at home in America this Christmas, I got really annoyed to hear about all my friends having exams before Christmas. If they just started the semester in mid September, they could have exams before the new year. That way, I'd have more than 2 measly weeks at home! Not to mention, the break before the second semester could be combined with the Christmas one- then we'd have a month off to spend it how we like, as in not studying!

[A66]

But........
You wouldn't have any ‘St Andrews Christmas’. Christmas parties, balls meals etc. Personally I far prefer the last two weeks to the time at home.

To fit exams in we would have to come back two week earlier. That would mean Freshers’ week in the first week of September, which wouldn't work as A-Levels only come out 2 weeks in advance therefore there is not enough time to sort out clearing and accommodation etc.

It wouldn't work with our current terms; if you don't want to revise at Christmas a better solution would be to drop the Spring break for a one week reading week. Make the Christmas holiday a week longer so people could start revising at New Year.

Or wait until the start of revision period; it is plenty long enough as it is.

[n01]

Perhaps we could start one week earlier and end one week later?

This year we started Sept 25, we could start Sept 18th (Having freshers week the week of the 11th).

This year we ended December 15th. We could end December 22nd. It is closer to Chrismas, but then again, you could fully enjoy it and have the whole month of January off!

I figure we need a total of two weeks for exams... About half a week (including a weekend) and one and a half weeks for the actual exams.

I think that all makes sense... no?

[hmmmhaveabanana]

We need one week's revision week and one and a half weeks for the exams. That makes 2 and a half weeks. That would mean we either (a) have a shorter semester or (b) start semester early/finish late. (a)won't work since it's already tough cramming it all into 11 weeks and we couldn't possibly finish 2nd semester any earlier - we already finish ridiculously early as it is! (b) won't work because we already start pretty early in comparison to the rest of the UK and since A-Levels come out so late it's just not possible. We also finish quite late (next year it's 22nd Dec).

Other thoughts:
-A longer Christmas and Easter break would be nice.
- The inter-semester break is good for holidays but isn't essential
-Semesters are good for flexibility and making exams easier but terms means you can fit more work in (Oxford and 24 teaching weeks with extra weeks either side for exams and such like, we only have 22).

Conclusion - go back to terms, or change the whole education system to make it more like American universities (in terms of the term dates) or stick with what we've got.

[n01]

Quoting hmmmhaveabanana from 17:55, 13th Jan 2007
We need one week's revision week and one and a half weeks for the exams. That makes 2 and a half weeks.

meh we don't really need a whole week for revision. this year we technically had 6 days of "revision" week, if we had revision time starting on a saturday and going to a tues or wednesday, that would be enough (4 or 5 days). seeing as not everyone has exams the first day anyways.

plus, do we really need that extra day of doing nothing but worry about how we aren't revising?

[abc123]

what we dont need is a 4 month bleeding summer to bum about and forget everything related to our course.....

i know there's reasons for it but still....i could use an extra 2 months to actually try to learn things!

[A66]

Quoting abc123 from 18:39, 13th Jan 2007
what we dont need is a 4 month bleeding summer to bum about and forget everything related to our course.....

i know there's reasons for it but still....i could use an extra 2 months to actually try to learn things!

Well some of us need to work every hour God sends during that period to pay for Uni. One thing St Andrews has right is we break up before most other Unis and get get first stab at the small amount of student jobs out there

[Orcas]

Or we could use some of that summer time as term time and get our degree in less time. Now that'd I'd like.

[hr]

www.sufrasees.blogspot.co,

[Alesha]

You should look at the semester dates for next year. Apparently teaching doesnt start til 1st Octoberish and we don't break up for xmas until the 22nd, but still revision wk starts the 7th of Jan. Is it just me or is that a bit strange?

[BasilSeal]

Quoting Al from 10:01, 13th Jan 2007

Quoting Frank from 02:17, 13th Jan 2007
What has the history of the exam setup been in St Andrews, was it changed to this way because another was unworkable, perhaps?

Well, before semesterisation - back in the days when the academic year started in October and was divided into three terms - some exams were held at the end of each of the first two terms and in the middle of the third. Back then there were two types of exam: class exams (held each term) and degree exams (held at the end of the year). If a sub-honours student did well enough in their written work and class exams then they could get an "exemption" from sitting their end of year exams.

This was a *great* system, especially if you got three exemptions in your first two years. Then you essentially got the third term off... Which was a lot of fun for all the obvious reasons, plus the fact that you could then just pop into lectures when you liked the subject, whether you were taking the course or not. I recall that the anthropology lectures on gypsies were especially well-attended.

Of course, this also came along with having all your finals (which, in Arts, determined your entire degree) in a week or two at the end of your fourth year, so it wasn't all roses.

Bloody fun, though, all of it.

[David Bean]

Quoting Orcas from 21:32, 13th Jan 2007
Or we could use some of that summer time as term time and get our degree in less time. Now that'd I'd like.

If you want to do that, go to Buckingham (of gcourse, you'd have to pay, because it's a private university) and get a degree in two years. Or you could go to any other university in England and do it in three years without working through the summer. But I'm blowed if I'd have wanted to do that - more time at university equates to more time to develop as a person before you get a full time job, and that's definitely a good thing.

Also, I don't want to sound mean spirited but not everyone has the option of working through the summer. I come from a small town in Perthshire, and there wasn't much work going around there!

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Psalm 91:7