60+ students occupy uni building in protest

[Al]

Also, they were sitting with Andrew Keenan, president of the SA. Surely if there was a problem, he would have said something.

That's just idiotic. If he was with them - and if they were being disruptive - then he was part of the problem. He was hardly going to anything about it, was he? Besides, he wouldn't be the first sabb (or other member of the UMC/SSC) to let friends or acquaintances get away with things that would not be tolerated in others.

[777]

Jesus Wept.

The university has a wide inclusion policy, some are bound to slip under the radar.

An extract from your CV? Would explain a lot.

Elucidate.

[777]

More solidarity

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/4/20090226/tuk ... a1618.html

[Cain]

More solidarity

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/4/20090226/tuk ... a1618.html

Approximately 94,000 people are occupying the Worcester until the town council decides to twin with Gaza.

[macgamer]

More solidarity

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/4/20090226/tuk ... a1618.html

I heard via Radio 4; please no, it is so inane.

[Lukey2]

Well, thank goodness that's over, and well done to the protestors on achieving precisely nothing. The scholarships should be very interesting indeed, given the past success demonstrated in that area. I'm amused by Harry's comment that that's the fastest Kevin Dunion has seen the university move - would that be in his many days of working with them? I've certainly known them move as quickly as any other institution but always found, from actually dealing with them, that approaching them in a calm, rational and adult fashion was considerably more effective.

I find it amusing that you paid so little attention during Kevin Dunion's campaign. Even if three months is not an incredibly long time, he WAS a student at this University for four years. If you were present at either of the times he addressed the occupation, you would know that in his time here he participated in occupations as well. Clearly, his experience in negotiating with the University did not begin when he became rector.

As long as we're on the subject of things I find amusing, I'd like to chuckle again at all the people who think the occupation failed. The occupation is over, but negotiations are ongoing. Remember that the SA has already published its support of most of our demands, and that they will be present, along with our representatives, at all the upcoming negotiations with the University. Even if we hadn't gained an inch of ground on any of our demands, you would still be wrong about the occupation accomplishing nothing. At least 60 people have been brought together and arguably radicalized by the very experience of occupying LCH. The majority of them were in first or second year, so you can expect them to continue causing trouble, particularly if the University drags its feet on any of its promises. Rest assured: the PSC and its members will provide you all with ample opportunities to be cruel and simple-minded over the internet. Who knows? Given the number of students who have participated in occupations over the last two months, you might even get to complain about a student movement that conceives of politics as something other than voting and--how did you have it?--behaving in a "rational and adult fashion."

[Senethro]

lol someones feeding their persecution complex

[777]

More solidarity

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/4/20090226/tuk ... a1618.html

Approximately 94,000 people are occupying the Worcester until the town council decides to twin with Gaza.

65 occupators in LCH -vs- 94000 occupators in Worcester. Some bastard always has to go one better.

[macgamer]

At least 60 people have been brought together and arguably radicalized by the very experience of occupying LCH. The majority of them were in first or second year, so you can expect them to continue causing trouble, particularly if the University drags its feet on any of its promises.

*Yawn. Well I hope they get dragged in front of the University Court on disciplinary charges and sent down.

Given the number of students who have participated in occupations over the last two months, you might even get to complain about a student movement that conceives of politics as something other than voting and--how did you have it?--behaving in a "rational and adult fashion."

I smell anarchism, how tiresome.

[Duggeh]

Haven't posted in this thread for a wee bit, just thought I'd keep myself in.


Nothing new to add. The "OCCCUPATORZS" were and are still idiots, and there's been a LOT of win on the part of the clear minded here. I have yet to see a post from a pro-OCCUPATORZS point of view which isn't some variety of lulz. Indeed, I think I have a visual representation of what they did, compared to what they wanted to happen.




Now Greece. They know how to do student protests.

[RandomMusings]

Now Greece. They know how to do student protests.

"Tell me more, tell me more, did you get very far.....
Tell me more, tell me more, .........."

- Oh, GREECE, not GREASE - my bad.

[Frank]

Since when did you become an expert on what I am an expert in?

He didn't claim that, he was asking you a question... Your response was pointless...

Since when did you become an expert on what is and isn't pointless?

As it happens, my post was without a point. Then again, the part I quoted in my reply was also without a point... other than to express doubt about my knowledge. The expression "Since when did you become an expert in...?" is used in a derogatory manner to imply that the person being questioned is no expert at all.

Hence my reply.

Of course, I won't press the point, but it is true, is it not, that you're not actually an expert on the matter, and making spurious insinuations amounting to "If you laugh at this, you're a dirty commie/evil/lack-moral-fibre/lack-sufficient-fibre-in-your-diet!". The point of my post noting the plausibility of being able to find outrageous jokes funny and being able to empathise with someone's suffering was surely not missed, but I said I wouldn't press the point...

Anyway

This has come up a few times. "If you don't care/laugh, you don't have a heart!"

I'd note that in my own (limited) experience it's been possible to empathise with someone's pain, despair, general-situation and accept the fact that they're being idiots. Acknowledging that someone is to blame for their own situation, say, or neglecting to answer their plight in exactly the manner they demand is something not strictly at odds with feeling love, compassion or general humanly warmth for a person.

Just because I happen to think the occupation was a pile of poop needn't (and doesn't) mean I disagree with the three points of the petition I outlined earlier. I'm pretty sure that doesn't need to be expanded/generalised explicitly upon on every case of someone saying something on the internet...

[exnihilo]

I find it amusing that you paid so little attention during Kevin Dunion's campaign. Even if three months is not an incredibly long time, he WAS a student at this University for four years. If you were present at either of the times he addressed the occupation, you would know that in his time here he participated in occupations as well. Clearly, his experience in negotiating with the University did not begin when he became rector.

Yes, he was a student in a very different time. What did the occupations he participated in achieve, incidentally, and what were they about? I'd be fascinated to learn. For what it's worth, I did pay little attention during his campaign, yes, but having been a student at St Andrews for a long time and having served both in the Students' Association and on the University Court I assure you that a great deal more than your "victory" was achieved, in a far shorter time and with far less idiotic self-congratulation, by simply approaching the University authorities in the proper fashion. What you have done was simple grandstanding, it has gained nothing concrete, and served only to massage the ego of a pathetically small handful of "radicalized" students. Congratulations.

[Haunted]

Even if we hadn't gained an inch of ground on any of our demands, you would still be wrong about the occupation accomplishing nothing. At least 60 people have been brought together and arguably radicalized by the very experience of occupying LCH. The majority of them were in first or second year, so you can expect them to continue causing trouble, particularly if the University drags its feet on any of its promises.

As if an embarrassing defeat wasn't enough of a humiliation you just have to come out and confirm that the whole thing really was nothing but self indulgent smug wankery. Radicalised indeed.

[777]

Even if we hadn't gained an inch of ground on any of our demands, you would still be wrong about the occupation accomplishing nothing.

It doesn't matter how much distraction powder you scatter around, the whole fiasco was a complete failure. You were supposed to be forcing the university to cancel the Eden Springs contract, fund TEN scholarships for Palestinian students and squeeze the Bute medical school dry over supplies (note to occupators, there aint a hospital attached to the Bute) amongst other crud.

Now it's been turned into a successful huge mass bonding process. If students require academic families, Raisin weekend exists for fun and games.

[777]

At least 60 people have been brought together and arguably radicalized by the very experience of occupying LCH. The majority of them were in first or second year, so you can expect them to continue causing trouble

So really this was nothing to do with Gaza but all about popping protest cherries.

[Jonni]

The St. Andrews Palestinian Solidarity Campaign, which occupied Lower and Upper College Hall from Wednesday February 18th until Wednesday 25th February in solidarity with the Palestinian people and in opposition to the University’s links to companies implicated in Israel’s occupation of Palestine would like to thank staff and students for their strong levels of support. The campaign has also received support from Noam Chomsky, Rob Harper MSP, Sandra White MSP, Pauline McNeill MSP, the playwright Carol Churchill and many other people from across the world.

Yesterday we decided that although our demands had not been fully met, we had gained considerable concessions and decided to end the occupation. We’re amused and surprised by the cheap parting shot at the end of the University’s mass e-mail: “We believe that all the issues should have been raised, and could have been resolved, through the existing processes of dialogue”. As far as we’re concerned, the University has consistently changed its position in negotiations with us, being forced to make more and more concessions until we agreed to leave. The scope of those concessions is noted below. We believe that our occupation demonstrates the power of direct action, of people gathering together and speaking truth to power, of seizing democratic free expression and autonomous spaces into their own hands, and that we could never have achieved as much through the meager “existing processes”. Our occupation has been a fresh break from the tedium and apathy of student politics — a new democratic expression!


1 ) The University conceded their current policy was not sustainable, or in keeping with their position as a Fairtrade University and have pledged to switch to tap water at the soonest possible time. Whilst the University has not been willing to cancel the contract, we are convinced that, with our and student association participation in ethical procurement policies, a renewal of the Eden springs contract is extremely unlikely.

2) We campaigned for the University to apply the same ethical standards that they do to investment to procurement and research. The University has conceded that its position is inconsistent and will now regularly communicate its research proposals to the Students Association and the student body. We have also gained representation on working committees which will review ethical procurement and research and will continue push to exclude companies like BAE systems from campus.

3) While the campaign was unable to secure 10 scholarships exclusively for Palestinian students, the University has promised to set up a scholarship programme for people whose studies have been interrupted by conflict and natural disaster. The campaign will be advising the University on this scheme, the first of its kind. The university have also pledged that Palestine will qualify for this scholarship scheme and the scheme will be publicised there. We have also received assurances from the university that they will help in setting up a charity with the aim of funding scholarships purely for Palestinian students.

4) The University and the Student's Association are currently reviewing long-term links with Universities in Palestine as part of a commitment to further its worldwide academic relationships. Said a spokesperson for the Islamic University of Gaza, "We would like to express our sincere thanks and deep appreciation to the students of St Andrews for all of their conscious efforts, endeavours and demands to support the right to education, justice and freedom in Palestine." Unmentioned in the statement from Christopher Smith, the university has also agreed to ask departments to donate non-financial aid such as computers, course books and chairs to Gaza.

5) We are currently working with Bute Medical School to pinpoint supplies that will be sent to Gaza. In principle a commitment to sending medical aid has been secured

In addition, the students association will:
1) Provide a venue, equipment and advertising for a showing of the DEC appeal. This will be featured on the Association website
2) Assist with the founding of a charity which has the aim of endowing scholarships for Palestinian students
3) Ensure effective representation of, and communication with, the St. Andrews Palestinian Solidarity Campaign in the processes and reviews with regards to ethical research and procurement
4) Advertise and promote any appeal for non-monetary aid to be collected in St. Andrews, including any Gaza appeal.

Yours,

The St. Andrews Palestinian Solidarity Campaign

[munchingfoo]

[Jono]

Also, they were sitting with Andrew Keenan, president of the SA. Surely if there was a problem, he would have said something.

That's just idiotic. If he was with them - and if they were being disruptive - then he was part of the problem. He was hardly going to anything about it, was he? Besides, he wouldn't be the first sabb (or other member of the UMC/SSC) to let friends or acquaintances get away with things that would not be tolerated in others.

That's not entirely fair! For one thing, the bar wasn't any louder that night than it usually is on a Wednesday night. For two, if an Officer or Sab has consumed alcohol, then they cannot act in any official capacity. If Andrew was out for the night, then he can't be expected to keep people quiet. that's why we hire security. Finally in my experience of being repeatedly (and justifiably) dressed down by the Association President for my manifold breaches of discipline this year, I can state categorically that he's not into playing favourites!

[Craig]

For the sake of clarity, the university did not concede to any of the occupiers’ ‘demands’. Our position was consistent throughout and did not change.

A university spokesman, from this article. Concessions? Wot concessions?