Back in St Andrews

[munchingfoo]

4 months away, and things have changed!

New shop where woolies used to be.

No more electrical shop on market street.

The A91 is closed for 15 weeks!!!

Anything else changed since Christmas?

[ojk6]

Possibly also a new bakery on South Street?

[RedCelt69]

Anything else changed since Christmas?

Much less snow.

[queen of scots]

There's one less seal in the sealife centre

[Nisbet]

Aw maaaaan that seal news is proper gutting likes !
There is ALSO the fact that 'new tesco' sells Buckfast. I don't know if that's just a Scottish person thing to note, but up here in St A it's mighty hard ta find!

[RedCelt69]

There is ALSO the fact that 'new tesco' sells Buckfast. I don't know if that's just a Scottish person thing to note, but up here in St A it's mighty hard ta find!

Thankfully, not all Scots have a taste for Buckfast. There's probably a very good reason that it isn't easily found in St Andrews. Not too many schemies in The Bubble.

[wild_quinine]

Thankfully, not all Scots have a taste for Buckfast. There's probably a very good reason that it isn't easily found in St Andrews. Not too many schemies in The Bubble.

Venture out aways into the badlands of an evening and you'll see just how rough things can get.

[RedCelt69]

Thankfully, not all Scots have a taste for Buckfast. There's probably a very good reason that it isn't easily found in St Andrews. Not too many schemies in The Bubble.

Venture out aways into the badlands of an evening and you'll see just how rough things can get.

Oh, I don't doubt that for a moment. It would be a strange Stepfords Wives place that didn't have such areas. I was referring to the ratio of such people in St Andrews... compared to other less Bubblesque parts of Scotland.

[Haunted]

Venture out aways into the badlands of an evening and you'll see just how rough things can get.

The neds in this town are a harmless joke, you might get some slang voiced in your direction but you won't be mugged, stabbed, glassed or victim to any number of other incidents like you would be if you walked down the wrong alley in any big city.

[wild_quinine]

The neds in this town are a harmless joke, you might get some slang voiced in your direction but you won't be mugged, stabbed, glassed or victim to any number of other incidents like you would be if you walked down the wrong alley in any big city.

You're safe anywhere until you're not. I reckon maybe it's easier to be smart in a city, but when you get fucked out in the middle of nowhere, your chips are more likely to be down.

[RedCelt69]

You're safe anywhere until you're not. I reckon maybe it's easier to be smart in a city, but when you get fucked out in the middle of nowhere, your chips are more likely to be down.

This thread has followed an interesting path. Somewhere, between the drinking of a seriously awful "wine" and banjo-playing links to Deliverance, there's a causal link that isn't altogether obvious.

[DACrowe]

Venture out aways into the badlands of an evening and you'll see just how rough things can get.

The neds in this town are a harmless joke, you might get some slang voiced in your direction but you won't be mugged, stabbed, glassed or victim to any number of other incidents like you would be if you walked down the wrong alley in any big city.

It's an outrageously middle class town, populated principally by students and pensioners - of course there's no real 'badlands'. As a Glaswegian I had always assumed people were joking when they used the term but I've since learned some people actually think there's a 'rough' part of St Andrews. Glenrothes maybe but... really? Rough is the occasional reports of people getting stabbed on the bus for no reason or people flinging things at you from tower blocks. When's the last time you even heard of a mugging in St Andrews?

[wild_quinine]

It's an outrageously middle class town, populated principally by students and pensioners - of course there's no real 'badlands'. As a Glaswegian I had always assumed people were joking when they used the term but I've since learned some people actually think there's a 'rough' part of St Andrews.

I think we are joking, really. But there is a contrast that's worthy of note. The middle of St. Andrews reminds me of the middle of Edinburgh. Unlike many large cities that maybe grew up around industry, the centre of St. Andrews is the nice bit. South of Kinnessburn Road, there are a few places that are just like anywhere else for trouble, which is a definite step down from the 'bubble', a place in which wandering around barefoot in your pyjamas seems merely eccentric.

When's the last time you even heard of a mugging in St Andrews?

That is not a good argument, though. Crimes do take place in St. Andrews, and it's no better a place to be a victim than anywhere else.

[DACrowe]

When's the last time you even heard of a mugging in St Andrews?

That is not a good argument, though. Crimes do take place in St. Andrews, and it's no better a place to be a victim than anywhere else.

http://www.fife.police.uk/default.aspx?page=1757 Well of course it's not fun to be a victim of crime, but it's much less likely to happen in St Andrews than in most places in the UK. One of the main reasons is probably demographics; as I said the majority of people are students or pensioners. The town centre is dominated by students and empty holiday homes. Rutherglen Main Street, two blocks from my old high school, is notorious for having a large number of heroin addicts staying in the council housing there. When a friend moved in he suffered three break-in attempts in the first month. I've been delivering things to Easterhouse in the past and had people chuck bottles at me from the tenements for no reason. I'm told, though it surprised me, by one of Glasgow's ex SRC Presidents that rape on Kelvin Way is a shockingly common phenomenon, such that she doesn't feel safe walking down it alone at night. That's a street /right next door/ to the uni, out in the West End (though with dodgy lighting and Kelvingrove to one side). Even in Cambridge thefts, break-ins and muggings are common enough that everyone knows someone who's had it happen to them (you're told 'well don't go across Midsommer Common at night').

By contrast, it may just be me, but I never (or hardly ever) hear of these things happening in St Andrews. There aren't, to my knowledge, any clear no-go areas.

which is a definite step down from the 'bubble', a place in which wandering around barefoot in your pyjamas seems merely eccentric.

I dare say that's true, but the 'pajama test' is hardly the last word in defining urban squalor. The town centre's accommodation is dominated by students. What homes aren't are mostly second homes or inhabited by pensioners. The area is well patrolled at night (try cycling without a light; see how far you get) and you're never more than three streets from the police station. I seem to recall being told the police station doesn't actually have any capacity to hold people. I'm sure the 'badlands' does seem a contrast, and yes there is residential housing which looks a bit grubby in places, but I can't help feel that the constant references to it as the 'badlands' are a) offensive towards the people who live there and b) paint an unrealistic portrayal of the area which makes me cringe a little every time I hear it. I know a lot of people use the term ironically; I can only presume that those who use it unironically have little or no experience living in a high crime (or even moderate) crime area.

[DACrowe]

Wow. I managed to completely misread your first paragraph (or else I misread the first sentence as 'Now I think we are joking' and inferred the rest from there. So I should probably distance myself from some of the vitriol above. I believe I stand by it, but nonetheless it will now look a bit strange in the actual context in which it appears in the thread.

[Thereisnospoon]

When's the last time you even heard of a mugging in St Andrews?

That is not a good argument, though. Crimes do take place in St. Andrews, and it's no better a place to be a victim than anywhere else.

I dare say that's true, but the 'pajama test' is hardly the last word in defining urban squalor. The town centre's accommodation is dominated by students. What homes aren't are mostly second homes or inhabited by pensioners. The area is well patrolled at night (try cycling without a light; see how far you get) and you're never more than three streets from the police station. I seem to recall being told the police station doesn't actually have any capacity to hold people. I'm sure the 'badlands' does seem a contrast, and yes there is residential housing which looks a bit grubby in places, but I can't help feel that the constant references to it as the 'badlands' are a) offensive towards the people who live there and b) paint an unrealistic portrayal of the area which makes me cringe a little every time I hear it. I know a lot of people use the term ironically; I can only presume that those who use it unironically have little or no experience living in a high crime (or even moderate) crime area.

Just a note on the cycling thing - in first semester(when I still had my lovely bike), I often cycled in the very early hours with no lights/no brakes, passed the police patrolling multiple times, but was not stopped. Assumed it was just because the police here are awesome.

I agree with everything else you said though, but would also note that one of my friends had two bikes stolen in first semester...not sure who's running the bike theft scene here.

[Fawksie]

I seem to recall being told the police station doesn't actually have any capacity to hold people.

Oh, it does, they just decided in their infinite wisdom to discontinue use of local holding cells and send everyone in Fife to the HQ in Glenrothes. Makes for great fun when they turf them out in the morning to find their own way back home.

[DACrowe]

Just a note on the cycling thing - in first semester(when I still had my lovely bike), I often cycled in the very early hours with no lights/no brakes, passed the police patrolling multiple times, but was not stopped. Assumed it was just because the police here are awesome.

I agree with everything else you said though, but would also note that one of my friends had two bikes stolen in first semester...not sure who's running the bike theft scene here.

I get stopped every time I even forget to switch my lights on. Maybe you just cycle in a way which makes you seem an upright citizen. Or faster.

Bike theft - I've (a) heard about it and (b) had some bugger saw through half my bike lock however it's still no patch on Cambridge for bike theft (let alone real cities) and I've also accidentally left my bike unlocked, in one case for several days, without incident. Cambridge there's vans traveling around on a semi-regular basis at night picking up any bikes which aren't physically attached to thing (i.e. just locked to themselves).

[MelissaL]

I live in the 'badlands' but find them amazingly nice! Perhaps not as upmarket as some of the stuff in town centre or whereabouts, but still amazingly friendly and safe. A friend of mine did refer to them as 'dodgy,' but I think he really meant 'cheap and so wouldn't be caught dead living there.'

Of course, I've lived in some big cities in America and actually know what badlands and dodgy looks like, so this is paradise in my eyes. (I also had to have someone explain why I was being way too paranoid about missing my pepper spray and such, as I was extremely unlikely to ever be attacked). I don't think I've ever lived somewhere this safe.

That said, some good friends of mine had their house broken in to last year. Window smashed, many valuables taken (inlcuding laptops). They felt quite violated and shaken, but fortunately home insurance covered most of the loss. So it still happens, even in as quiet and safe a place as St Andrews.

[steelegbr]

So it still happens, even in as quiet and safe a place as St Andrews.

Indeed. I'd be surprised if there wasn't any of that sort of stuff going on everywhere, even in the most rural parts of the highlands. The "badlands" is a rather ridiculous name in my opinion - definitely gives the wrong impression of the place. Though, I do wonder how many of the people that think the area is rough have actually been there...