Yo. As a constant presence (noticed or not) at Rocksoc nights for well on a year and a half now I've finally gotten the courage to post something on the topic of playlists.
They seem repetitive.
Why is it that I can almost bet on hearing the same songs every time there is a Rocksoc night? I understand the difficulties in being a dj, as I've been one in the past and spent two years djing a weekly two hour slot at my college radio station. It's fucking harsh to come up with a new original and awe inspiring set every time you get behind that damn mixing board. But I honestly feel like Rocksoc has gone stale. I'm tired of coming out, and feel a bit dissapointed at the end of the night. I'm not one to just sit and brood in a corner, when I come out I come out to dance like a monkey to every song that amuses me, but lately I've been sitting through the majority of Rocksoc.
I know djs try to mix in new music with old standbys to get people to dance as much as possible, but I feel like there isn't much creativity going into setlists. If you're going to play a song from an artist you play *every week*, why not try to play one of their lesser known songs? One that might not have gotten radio play, and one that will help people get a good idea of the spectrum of that artist's work. You're the ones with the bumload of cd's...teach us what good music is! Our ears are open. Rocksoc is a fantastic opportunity for new music.
I hope none of this came off as insulting. I really just wanted to make a suggestion. I like learning about new music, and like to hear stuff that is different and little known. I'd just like to see Rocksoc make the most of their rapt audience and be as kickass as it possibly can be.
Home
TheSinner.net
(don't) play it again sam.
15 posts
• Page 1 of 1
(don't) play it again sam.
by shivaree on Wed Dec 17, 2003 12:24 am
-
shivaree
- Posts: 21
- Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2002 6:24 pm
Re:
by benedict on Wed Dec 17, 2003 1:59 am
good point really. there are certain songs that seem to be RockSoc staples like Dude Looks Like a Lady, Poison & err stuff. such tracks i guess get played a lot as they do tend to fill the dance floor.
of course it'll be Top of the Rocks this thursday so us members will only have our collective selves to blame if we don't like it this time round.
anyway here's some tracks i'd like to played now & again:
Nine Inch Nails - Sin, Happiness In Slavery or Heresy
Mr Manson - Sweet Dreams or User Friendly (why nobody's played that track i don't know, it's class)
Jane's Addiction - Mountain Song
Ministry - Jesus Built My Hot Rod, Bad Blood, Just One Fix or Burning Inside (but not NWO as it's comparatively dull)
Skunk Anansie - Weak or Charlie Big Potato.
Placebo - Nancy Boy or Every Me Every You
most of those should be fairly well known & not difficult to get hold of.
for earlier on in the night it'd be nice to hear a bit of proper industrial now & again. stuff like Skinny Puppy, Front 242, :Wumpscut:, VNV Nation or Suicide Commando. now that Tryste has gone there seems to be hardly any EBM/industrial played in Venue 2 sadly.
of course it'll be Top of the Rocks this thursday so us members will only have our collective selves to blame if we don't like it this time round.
anyway here's some tracks i'd like to played now & again:
Nine Inch Nails - Sin, Happiness In Slavery or Heresy
Mr Manson - Sweet Dreams or User Friendly (why nobody's played that track i don't know, it's class)
Jane's Addiction - Mountain Song
Ministry - Jesus Built My Hot Rod, Bad Blood, Just One Fix or Burning Inside (but not NWO as it's comparatively dull)
Skunk Anansie - Weak or Charlie Big Potato.
Placebo - Nancy Boy or Every Me Every You
most of those should be fairly well known & not difficult to get hold of.
for earlier on in the night it'd be nice to hear a bit of proper industrial now & again. stuff like Skinny Puppy, Front 242, :Wumpscut:, VNV Nation or Suicide Commando. now that Tryste has gone there seems to be hardly any EBM/industrial played in Venue 2 sadly.
-
benedict
Re:
by Simon on Wed Dec 17, 2003 4:27 am
Congratulations, Benedict, on completely missing the point. Someone raises a valid point about the rocksoc playlists and their lack of variety, giving you the opportunity to suggest what should be done about it, and you turn it into a "my favourite songs of the last five minutes" thread. Oh well....
Anyway, getting back on topic, the repetitive nature (or lack thereof) of rocksoc playlists and DJ sets has been a problem for years. Waaaaay back in the mists of time (1991) when Rocksoc started up, we only had one DJ with an extensive, but ultimately limited collection of CDs. However the dance floor was stil packed every night, from 10pm to closing.
To be honest, the rocksock playlists may seem a little repetetive to some nowadays, but I don't think that's the root of the problem. I've been giving this a lot of thought over the last few months (and had several heated discussions in the pub about it too, with rocksoc past and present) and I think it boils down to this:
Rocksoc simply can't find the balance between new music that no-one knows (and therefore doesn't fill the dancefloor except for a couple of folks at a time), and playing classics every night that people get bored of.
I hope the DJs don't take offence at this because I have the utmost respect for those doing a very difficult job, but the format needs to change. Giving each DJ an half-hour or hour slot kills the night. Either a DJ tries to play new stuff, or tries to fill the floor with the same old classics and there's only so many classics you can fit into an hour slot to guarantee people dancing - you know what works so you stick to it. In my opinion, each DJ should be given a night in rotation. Play what you want of new stuff early on, and let people hear fresh music by all means. If a particular song gets a good reaction, play it again in your next set and move it to later in the set. It'll get known and people will dance to it. You also have the chance to recover if a particular song doesn't do well, rather than being tied to a 60 minute slot and a predetermined setlist. Pick a certain number of songs beforehand, but give yourself te freedom to adapt to the mood of the floor on the night. the key though, is that from 11pm onwards, the dance floor should never empty!
If this means compromising your artistic integrity, then so be it. You're there to entertain, not educate (at least later in the night). To be honest, I'll go and sit down for a large chunk of the night if there's a half-dozen songs in a row that I don't know and thus I lose interest in what's being played (and it's not just cos I'm getting old!). If I know there's a good chance that there will be a song I want to dance to in one or two sngs time, I'll keep an ear on the music as well as my conversations.
If I want to listen to new and "alternative" (pigeon-hole that where you will) music, I'l do it at home. I go to rocksoc to enjoy and to jump around like a loon on occasion. That measn songs I know and songs I can dance to.
Part of the problem is that rock has got so diverse over the last five years that you can't please all the people all the time (hence why we have deviant noise these days). Ten years ago, there was thrash, hair-rock, metal and goth - that pretty much covered it. It was easy to play a mix for the last two hours of the night and everyone knew everything and would get up and dance to it. The job these days is much harder.
But (and it';s a big but)... playing a half-hour of industrial goth to cater for a few folk is going to kill the night for everyone else. Even if you followed it by Iron Maiden and Therapy?, chances are that it's going to take another half-hour to get folks who aren't industrial-goth fans back in the mood to dance.
I don't profess to have all the answers, but having been to The Mission in Edinburgh on a regular basis, they have a knack of playing the right song at the right time to start filling the floor. From midnight unitl 3am in there, the mix of classics and new songs (but not unknown new songs) keeps folks up and dancing. You don't need to repeat the same songs each week, although some will invariably re-appear, but the balance that appeases the majority needs to be found from 11pm onwards so that people can dance for a couple of hours, or rocksoc will die.
I guess my argument boils down to less repeats, less personal indulgence later in the evening and less DJs per night so that a DJ can get a feel for the place and do a purely danceable last hour or two of the night.
Some songs will always be classics, but there's anough out there that they don't need to be played each week. However, they do need to be played. Rocksoc for dancing, home for new music.
Play your own personal tastes early on by all means, I have no problem with that. Educate us, who knows we may grow to love the stuff you play, but a DJ needs to a) read the crowd and b) be willing to sacrifice his personal taste in music for the sake of a good rocksoc night. You may love Meshuggah and loathe Alice Cooper, but Poison will get more folks on the floor at 12:30am than Corridor of Chameleons.
That example also sums up the number of DJs thing. A DJ may do a blinding set, starting with some relatively unknown stuff and culminating in four or five great songs to dance to at the end of their hour, but come the turn of the hour, the next DJ starts over with a new set and begins to build towards the end of the next 60 minutes. While this new set may be perfectly crafted to build to an almighty climax, the momentum of the night is lost as the new set begins. People go and sit down and it takes an age to get them back to the floor.
If multiple DJs are going to play in one night, the new one has to pick up from where the old one left off and keep the atmosphere going. For example, Alice at the end of one set followed my Meshuggah at the start of the next is going to send all bar a couple of people scurrying back to their seats or the bar. It's going to take you a while to entice them back through the door to the dancefloor. Starting with Meshuggah and ending on Alice may be fine for the 9-10 set, but not for the 11-12 set. DJs have to be aware of when they're on and adapt their set accordingly.
Best of luck, DJs, it's a thankless job you have. I hope, having seen rocksoc (and rock itself) evolve over the last 12 years, I can provide a few pointers on the road to recovery. Don't take it personally, it's just my opinion.
On the flip-side, you lot have to get up and dance. I'll admit I'm just as guilty as the rest of you, but if people sit there and go, "Oh yeah, I really enjoyed last week's rocksoc, the music was great, but I couldn't be arsed getting up," how are the DJs ever going to figure out what works and what doesn't?!?
Anyway, getting back on topic, the repetitive nature (or lack thereof) of rocksoc playlists and DJ sets has been a problem for years. Waaaaay back in the mists of time (1991) when Rocksoc started up, we only had one DJ with an extensive, but ultimately limited collection of CDs. However the dance floor was stil packed every night, from 10pm to closing.
To be honest, the rocksock playlists may seem a little repetetive to some nowadays, but I don't think that's the root of the problem. I've been giving this a lot of thought over the last few months (and had several heated discussions in the pub about it too, with rocksoc past and present) and I think it boils down to this:
Rocksoc simply can't find the balance between new music that no-one knows (and therefore doesn't fill the dancefloor except for a couple of folks at a time), and playing classics every night that people get bored of.
I hope the DJs don't take offence at this because I have the utmost respect for those doing a very difficult job, but the format needs to change. Giving each DJ an half-hour or hour slot kills the night. Either a DJ tries to play new stuff, or tries to fill the floor with the same old classics and there's only so many classics you can fit into an hour slot to guarantee people dancing - you know what works so you stick to it. In my opinion, each DJ should be given a night in rotation. Play what you want of new stuff early on, and let people hear fresh music by all means. If a particular song gets a good reaction, play it again in your next set and move it to later in the set. It'll get known and people will dance to it. You also have the chance to recover if a particular song doesn't do well, rather than being tied to a 60 minute slot and a predetermined setlist. Pick a certain number of songs beforehand, but give yourself te freedom to adapt to the mood of the floor on the night. the key though, is that from 11pm onwards, the dance floor should never empty!
If this means compromising your artistic integrity, then so be it. You're there to entertain, not educate (at least later in the night). To be honest, I'll go and sit down for a large chunk of the night if there's a half-dozen songs in a row that I don't know and thus I lose interest in what's being played (and it's not just cos I'm getting old!). If I know there's a good chance that there will be a song I want to dance to in one or two sngs time, I'll keep an ear on the music as well as my conversations.
If I want to listen to new and "alternative" (pigeon-hole that where you will) music, I'l do it at home. I go to rocksoc to enjoy and to jump around like a loon on occasion. That measn songs I know and songs I can dance to.
Part of the problem is that rock has got so diverse over the last five years that you can't please all the people all the time (hence why we have deviant noise these days). Ten years ago, there was thrash, hair-rock, metal and goth - that pretty much covered it. It was easy to play a mix for the last two hours of the night and everyone knew everything and would get up and dance to it. The job these days is much harder.
But (and it';s a big but)... playing a half-hour of industrial goth to cater for a few folk is going to kill the night for everyone else. Even if you followed it by Iron Maiden and Therapy?, chances are that it's going to take another half-hour to get folks who aren't industrial-goth fans back in the mood to dance.
I don't profess to have all the answers, but having been to The Mission in Edinburgh on a regular basis, they have a knack of playing the right song at the right time to start filling the floor. From midnight unitl 3am in there, the mix of classics and new songs (but not unknown new songs) keeps folks up and dancing. You don't need to repeat the same songs each week, although some will invariably re-appear, but the balance that appeases the majority needs to be found from 11pm onwards so that people can dance for a couple of hours, or rocksoc will die.
I guess my argument boils down to less repeats, less personal indulgence later in the evening and less DJs per night so that a DJ can get a feel for the place and do a purely danceable last hour or two of the night.
Some songs will always be classics, but there's anough out there that they don't need to be played each week. However, they do need to be played. Rocksoc for dancing, home for new music.
Play your own personal tastes early on by all means, I have no problem with that. Educate us, who knows we may grow to love the stuff you play, but a DJ needs to a) read the crowd and b) be willing to sacrifice his personal taste in music for the sake of a good rocksoc night. You may love Meshuggah and loathe Alice Cooper, but Poison will get more folks on the floor at 12:30am than Corridor of Chameleons.
That example also sums up the number of DJs thing. A DJ may do a blinding set, starting with some relatively unknown stuff and culminating in four or five great songs to dance to at the end of their hour, but come the turn of the hour, the next DJ starts over with a new set and begins to build towards the end of the next 60 minutes. While this new set may be perfectly crafted to build to an almighty climax, the momentum of the night is lost as the new set begins. People go and sit down and it takes an age to get them back to the floor.
If multiple DJs are going to play in one night, the new one has to pick up from where the old one left off and keep the atmosphere going. For example, Alice at the end of one set followed my Meshuggah at the start of the next is going to send all bar a couple of people scurrying back to their seats or the bar. It's going to take you a while to entice them back through the door to the dancefloor. Starting with Meshuggah and ending on Alice may be fine for the 9-10 set, but not for the 11-12 set. DJs have to be aware of when they're on and adapt their set accordingly.
Best of luck, DJs, it's a thankless job you have. I hope, having seen rocksoc (and rock itself) evolve over the last 12 years, I can provide a few pointers on the road to recovery. Don't take it personally, it's just my opinion.
On the flip-side, you lot have to get up and dance. I'll admit I'm just as guilty as the rest of you, but if people sit there and go, "Oh yeah, I really enjoyed last week's rocksoc, the music was great, but I couldn't be arsed getting up," how are the DJs ever going to figure out what works and what doesn't?!?
-
Simon
Re:
by Cain on Wed Dec 17, 2003 11:44 am
Simon - good post
on a return to the original question: could you organise the songs into A, B and C lists, like they do on the radio. except, rather than continually playing the A lsit songs, making sure that only a few get played every week, and that they don't get played two weeks in a row. on one night you could play A1, A2, A3 and then the next week play A4, A5, A6 etc.
Everybody gets songs that they know and like, but there isn't the same degree of reptition that you seem to be suffering from.
it sounds like getting the DJs together and working out a solution together would be a good idea.
best of luck guys
[hr]I hold an element of surprise
IMAGE:sponsoralisdair.freeservers.com/defend.gif
on a return to the original question: could you organise the songs into A, B and C lists, like they do on the radio. except, rather than continually playing the A lsit songs, making sure that only a few get played every week, and that they don't get played two weeks in a row. on one night you could play A1, A2, A3 and then the next week play A4, A5, A6 etc.
Everybody gets songs that they know and like, but there isn't the same degree of reptition that you seem to be suffering from.
it sounds like getting the DJs together and working out a solution together would be a good idea.
best of luck guys
[hr]I hold an element of surprise
IMAGE:sponsoralisdair.freeservers.com/defend.gif
I hold an element of surprise
-
Cain
- Posts: 4439
- Joined: Sat Jan 11, 2003 8:31 am
Re:
by shivaree on Wed Dec 17, 2003 12:33 pm
Simon, I don't think it's necessary to give Benedict a verbal bitch slapping. My post was entirely about making the Rocksoc setlists more appealing to the masses, who seem to have stopped dancing in hordes unless it's a song they know by heart. This is the *exact* sort of post where a paying member of the society should voice their opinions on what sort of music should be played more often at nights. How else will the dj's know what people are looking to dance to? Suggestions should be welcome, and not just ones that offer a "rearrangement" of the same old songs.
I don't think giving one dj free reign over the night is the answer to our variety problems. If anything, I think that will compound them. I like to hear a diverse amount of music, not one person indulging themselves for well on five hours. And no way is easier to run through one dj's easily dancable tracks than that. What happens when a dj known for doing one particular sort of music is advertised as the dj for that night? People who don't like that music simply won't come. And now that dj has lost even the opportunity to get them to dance.
I'm not sure what the answer is. On previous threads I've seen members describe rocksoc nights as a place to go out and hear new music and meet new people with similar interests. But honestly, it seems to me that the point of rocksoc is to ensure people dance all night. And that is unreasonable.
I don't think giving one dj free reign over the night is the answer to our variety problems. If anything, I think that will compound them. I like to hear a diverse amount of music, not one person indulging themselves for well on five hours. And no way is easier to run through one dj's easily dancable tracks than that. What happens when a dj known for doing one particular sort of music is advertised as the dj for that night? People who don't like that music simply won't come. And now that dj has lost even the opportunity to get them to dance.
I'm not sure what the answer is. On previous threads I've seen members describe rocksoc nights as a place to go out and hear new music and meet new people with similar interests. But honestly, it seems to me that the point of rocksoc is to ensure people dance all night. And that is unreasonable.
-
shivaree
- Posts: 21
- Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2002 6:24 pm
Re:
by Simon on Wed Dec 17, 2003 1:48 pm
Like I said above, it's a matter of finding the balance between new and old, unkonwn and known.
Giving a DJ free-reign with their own tastes early on is fine and if people want to hear new music then come along early. Equally, people should be able to come along and know they'll be able to dance, so from say 11pm onwards, you make sure you have two hours of known danceable stuff. Maybe not as rigid as that, but you get the idea.
Maybe the society should invest in a stack of CDs for communal use? That way DJs will have access to more "known" songs than just their own limited classics. If the society owned say 20 compilations from goth to industrial to air-guitar to whatever, then these can augment the DJs own stuff and you have a much wider choice of music to play, plus a DJ with mostly new material can still put together a danceable last hour without alienating parts of the crowd. The other part of this is that the DJs HAVE to be willing to play music that's outside their own personal tastes. Without that, you're right, it will end up being a complete turn-off for a lot of people.
I'm not saying no new music and I'm not saying no more classics. Rock is too diverse these days to please everyone all the time, but if folks know that they can go and dance and listen to new stuff earlier on, then they'll turn up at the time to suit them. It's that elusive balance that's the problem and to be honest, rocksoc hasn't found it at the moment. It's getting better, but it's not there yet....
(edited for multiple typos)
Giving a DJ free-reign with their own tastes early on is fine and if people want to hear new music then come along early. Equally, people should be able to come along and know they'll be able to dance, so from say 11pm onwards, you make sure you have two hours of known danceable stuff. Maybe not as rigid as that, but you get the idea.
Maybe the society should invest in a stack of CDs for communal use? That way DJs will have access to more "known" songs than just their own limited classics. If the society owned say 20 compilations from goth to industrial to air-guitar to whatever, then these can augment the DJs own stuff and you have a much wider choice of music to play, plus a DJ with mostly new material can still put together a danceable last hour without alienating parts of the crowd. The other part of this is that the DJs HAVE to be willing to play music that's outside their own personal tastes. Without that, you're right, it will end up being a complete turn-off for a lot of people.
I'm not saying no new music and I'm not saying no more classics. Rock is too diverse these days to please everyone all the time, but if folks know that they can go and dance and listen to new stuff earlier on, then they'll turn up at the time to suit them. It's that elusive balance that's the problem and to be honest, rocksoc hasn't found it at the moment. It's getting better, but it's not there yet....
(edited for multiple typos)
-
Simon
Re:
by Simon on Wed Dec 17, 2003 2:04 pm
As an afterthought, you may be right about the one-DJ-per-night being too much. Make it two DJs a night and over the course of a term, swap who gets the early and late sets. That way each gets a chance to play their music, whilst also doing well-known stuff for a danceable set. Guess it might make it easier to prepare if you know you've got to do a set of one sort or the other....
-
Simon
Re:
by xm_peex on Wed Dec 17, 2003 2:10 pm
I'd just like to say that I think Simon had a very valid point in saying something to Benedict. This was a thread to discuss how to solve the problem of the djs playing the same music all the time, not another chance for Benedict to go on about Skinny Puppy. (which he does far too regularly)
Basically, we already have a favourite songs thread (I believe started by Benedict himself)and so if djs want to see lists of songs that people like maybe they should try looking there.
And getting bak to the point of the thread, maybe the committee should have a suggestions box one night for things that people want to see at the discos. This way they can ascertain whether people want to dance or whether they just want to sit and drink and see mates etc. They should also be able to see from this what kind of music people want played. They can then have a meeting with the djs to try and find a suitable solution to the problem.
However, like Simon said, you can't please everyone all the time (and so Deviant Noise and Bulletproof and all the other music genre societies exist) and therefore the djs try they're hardest to please as many people as they can. One thing I would say though is that if someone wants a request played could the dj play it instead of saying at the beginning of the year that they would and then turning round on the night and saying "oh but i can't I've got these other songs that I want to play". They are there to let the other people have a good night, not just play stuff that they wanted to listen to. I think this may be half the trouble. djs play stuff they want and then realise that nobody is dancing and so they stick an old favourite on to get people's attention back.
Hope that didn't sound too much like a rant and wasn't too mixed up. I tend to type as I would speak and so it gets a bit difficult to understand sometimes. Either way, djs and committee need to find out what people want and then have a meeting to discuss it and find an answer.
[hr]I wish life had subtitles
Basically, we already have a favourite songs thread (I believe started by Benedict himself)and so if djs want to see lists of songs that people like maybe they should try looking there.
And getting bak to the point of the thread, maybe the committee should have a suggestions box one night for things that people want to see at the discos. This way they can ascertain whether people want to dance or whether they just want to sit and drink and see mates etc. They should also be able to see from this what kind of music people want played. They can then have a meeting with the djs to try and find a suitable solution to the problem.
However, like Simon said, you can't please everyone all the time (and so Deviant Noise and Bulletproof and all the other music genre societies exist) and therefore the djs try they're hardest to please as many people as they can. One thing I would say though is that if someone wants a request played could the dj play it instead of saying at the beginning of the year that they would and then turning round on the night and saying "oh but i can't I've got these other songs that I want to play". They are there to let the other people have a good night, not just play stuff that they wanted to listen to. I think this may be half the trouble. djs play stuff they want and then realise that nobody is dancing and so they stick an old favourite on to get people's attention back.
Hope that didn't sound too much like a rant and wasn't too mixed up. I tend to type as I would speak and so it gets a bit difficult to understand sometimes. Either way, djs and committee need to find out what people want and then have a meeting to discuss it and find an answer.
[hr]I wish life had subtitles
living in a world that protects fools
-
xm_peex
- Posts: 31
- Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 2:46 pm
Re:
by Simon on Wed Dec 17, 2003 2:21 pm
requests are a bit of a tricky area. If a song's requested outside of a Thursday night, a DJ should be able to work it into a set somewhere (as long as it's not too off-the-wall and available), but if I go up and request a 15-minute Dream Theater song at 11pm, it's unlikely to get played and I shouldn't be pissed off at that.
Don't expect a DJ to play every request if it's going to ruin the momentum/atmosphere that they're trying to achieve. Equally, there should e room for a few in each setlist, even if they're played at 9:15 rather than 12:15. That's got to be up to the DJ to use it if the request works with their set, and they have to have the option of not playing it at all without everyone whinging about how their song never got played. Another problem the poor bastards have to deal with....
Don't expect a DJ to play every request if it's going to ruin the momentum/atmosphere that they're trying to achieve. Equally, there should e room for a few in each setlist, even if they're played at 9:15 rather than 12:15. That's got to be up to the DJ to use it if the request works with their set, and they have to have the option of not playing it at all without everyone whinging about how their song never got played. Another problem the poor bastards have to deal with....
-
Simon
Warning - haphazard post
by raxenl on Wed Dec 17, 2003 2:49 pm
My personal take of the whole point of this thread is that RockSoc is getting repetitive and boring. I used to really love rocksoc. I even danced for most of my second year. But now I go and it seems like I'm paying to go to the same Rocksoc every week. Very occasionally a DJ will play something that I really like.
It seems like when setlists are being compiled thoughts like "I can't play that - it's not rock" are being...thought.
I've wanted to become a DJ for rocksoc since 2nd year, but I realise that I wouldn't get to DJ purely for that reason. Not everything I'd play would get people dancing. Especially now.
It is nice to think that rocksoc is our very own rock club - but it isn't. It's just a bar with better music - and a dancefloor. At least that is what it is becoming.
For me, RockSoc has such a large potential to be a fantastic forum for new, great music. I am tired of hearing the same songs every week by bands I like. For example 'SOAD - Chop Suey'. I like this band, but I am not part of the rock-radio generation - I like more than just a single released by a band's record company. They have so many other good songs, and so I'd like to hear some others. And not 'Sugar' either, their other single, which is starting to replace 'Chop Suey' in the SOAD playing stakes.
How about playing a good song by a band that isn't played often. That way poeple who had infact only heard the single, or popular songs might dance to it or ask the DJ which band it is. Does anyone see my point here?
Rocksoc infact isn't a rock club, and can never hope to emulate one.
I don't think a DJ monopoly is the solution. Niether do I think a great pile of RockSoc CD's will work either.
How about more DJ's? That would allow more types of [rock]music to be played.
I actually happen to disagree with Simon's comment that DJ's work up to a climax of their own hour long set. I can't believe we have DJ's that inept.
Yes, if this did happen (and it may be happening) it would suck - climax to slow build up would not work.
If I was to DJ I would most probably play a song that let the listeners know that a new DJ was on. Probably one of my favourite songs - as a DJ I would be aware that I wasn't starting with a cool, not-very-pumped crowd. I would realise that they were happy, and dancing and full of energy and wanted to continue to dance.
Not everyone always feels like dancing. What about the head-bobbers, or the foot tappers? They are enjoying the music too.
I realise I have probably written very disjointedly, but hopefully you can infer my actual meaning.
It seems like when setlists are being compiled thoughts like "I can't play that - it's not rock" are being...thought.
I've wanted to become a DJ for rocksoc since 2nd year, but I realise that I wouldn't get to DJ purely for that reason. Not everything I'd play would get people dancing. Especially now.
It is nice to think that rocksoc is our very own rock club - but it isn't. It's just a bar with better music - and a dancefloor. At least that is what it is becoming.
For me, RockSoc has such a large potential to be a fantastic forum for new, great music. I am tired of hearing the same songs every week by bands I like. For example 'SOAD - Chop Suey'. I like this band, but I am not part of the rock-radio generation - I like more than just a single released by a band's record company. They have so many other good songs, and so I'd like to hear some others. And not 'Sugar' either, their other single, which is starting to replace 'Chop Suey' in the SOAD playing stakes.
How about playing a good song by a band that isn't played often. That way poeple who had infact only heard the single, or popular songs might dance to it or ask the DJ which band it is. Does anyone see my point here?
Rocksoc infact isn't a rock club, and can never hope to emulate one.
I don't think a DJ monopoly is the solution. Niether do I think a great pile of RockSoc CD's will work either.
How about more DJ's? That would allow more types of [rock]music to be played.
I actually happen to disagree with Simon's comment that DJ's work up to a climax of their own hour long set. I can't believe we have DJ's that inept.
Yes, if this did happen (and it may be happening) it would suck - climax to slow build up would not work.
If I was to DJ I would most probably play a song that let the listeners know that a new DJ was on. Probably one of my favourite songs - as a DJ I would be aware that I wasn't starting with a cool, not-very-pumped crowd. I would realise that they were happy, and dancing and full of energy and wanted to continue to dance.
Not everyone always feels like dancing. What about the head-bobbers, or the foot tappers? They are enjoying the music too.
I realise I have probably written very disjointedly, but hopefully you can infer my actual meaning.
-
raxenl
Re:
by shivaree on Wed Dec 17, 2003 3:42 pm
quote:. If the society owned say 20 compilations from goth to industrial to air-guitar to whatever, then these can augment the DJs own stuff and you have a much wider choice of music to play, plus a DJ with mostly new material can still put together a danceable last hour without alienating parts of the crowd.
YES! I for one think thats an excellent idea. That way dj's don't have to be limited to their own "this'll get 'em dancin'" standbys and can have more freedom to play the weird stuff in their collection they've been aching to try out. These cds could even be compiled from dj's personal collections. Almost like a rocksoc "best of", and available for all djs to use. Might be a nice way to facilitate some dj communication too.
Also, this may be craaaazy, but would it be possible to try a half and half night? Make the first half of the night new dj's, trial runs, as it were. Give them a chance to play what they want, to freshen things up. Then for the second half of the night have one of the official rocksoc dj's take over and play their stuff. That way we'd be assured new, interesting music at the begining of the night, as the djs would be working their asses off to impress. And if a few of them happened to do particularly stellar jobs, they could always be graduated up to "late night" dj. (could be split up into a two hour new dj-three hours official dj set up.) Make the begining of the night experimental, as there usually isn't a packed crowd early in the night anyway. Not to say this time slot is throw-away my any means, but that it gives djs more room for experimentation.
(I've just been told "back in the day" there was a set up similar to this. Dj's would be auditioned at the begining of the year. But now the committee is in effect censoring what we hear. If it doesn't make it past *their* cut, we don't hear it. Perhaps letting the proletariate vote by head nods, monkey dances and compliments to the dj would be nice again. I understand why this change happened, because some people honestly can't dj, and shouldn't be allowed to dick up a good night, but I'd like to hear what other peope have to offer. Even if I have to be there at eight. *grumbles at the fact she'll have to start putting her makeup on at three in the afternoon now*)
And thanks to everyone for responding so well.
YES! I for one think thats an excellent idea. That way dj's don't have to be limited to their own "this'll get 'em dancin'" standbys and can have more freedom to play the weird stuff in their collection they've been aching to try out. These cds could even be compiled from dj's personal collections. Almost like a rocksoc "best of", and available for all djs to use. Might be a nice way to facilitate some dj communication too.
Also, this may be craaaazy, but would it be possible to try a half and half night? Make the first half of the night new dj's, trial runs, as it were. Give them a chance to play what they want, to freshen things up. Then for the second half of the night have one of the official rocksoc dj's take over and play their stuff. That way we'd be assured new, interesting music at the begining of the night, as the djs would be working their asses off to impress. And if a few of them happened to do particularly stellar jobs, they could always be graduated up to "late night" dj. (could be split up into a two hour new dj-three hours official dj set up.) Make the begining of the night experimental, as there usually isn't a packed crowd early in the night anyway. Not to say this time slot is throw-away my any means, but that it gives djs more room for experimentation.
(I've just been told "back in the day" there was a set up similar to this. Dj's would be auditioned at the begining of the year. But now the committee is in effect censoring what we hear. If it doesn't make it past *their* cut, we don't hear it. Perhaps letting the proletariate vote by head nods, monkey dances and compliments to the dj would be nice again. I understand why this change happened, because some people honestly can't dj, and shouldn't be allowed to dick up a good night, but I'd like to hear what other peope have to offer. Even if I have to be there at eight. *grumbles at the fact she'll have to start putting her makeup on at three in the afternoon now*)
And thanks to everyone for responding so well.
-
shivaree
- Posts: 21
- Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2002 6:24 pm
Re:
by benedict on Wed Dec 17, 2003 4:05 pm
just going to re-outline what i put before, hopefully slightly less ambiguously.
the way i interpreted the original post was that there's been a certain lack of variety in the setlists & that certain songs have been played & relied upon maybe a bit too much.
i would genrally agree with this sentiment (if i've interpreted it roughly correctly) & would add that it's perhaps that there are perhaps too many staples maybe being played too often, whereby you get a set where rather a high proportion of it consists of such staples.
take bands like Guns 'n Roses & Aerosmith. both bands have turned out a significant number of classic, well known & quite danceable tracks. yet in the above cases there seems to be a tendency of playing Dude Looks Like a Lady & Paradise City whilst ignoring other perfectly good hits.
as for the listing of a few songs at the end of my 1st post, these weren't just "my favourite songs of the last five minutes". i do hope that was meant as a witty exaggeration.
what i was trying to do was suggest a number of tracks which would be suitable for playing on the dance floor, i.e. songs which rock, which are danceable & which enough folk should know (i've been to enough rock clubs to know which songs work). i was merely trying to be constructive by offering some alternative songs to the staples we usually get (like the afforementionned Chop Suey). if this came across wrong then i offer my apologies.
on to the less song-specific side of things i'd say that having 2 djs may allow there to be a smoother flow but there would be some down sides as well.
many (if not all) of the djs in RockSoc have their own distinctive style & so if you generally don't like one dj's music selections then you're sometimes limited to sitting it out for a long period of time. having three djs does offer a chance to hear a variety of dj setlists which means that whilst it might not be as good for some it does at least give other members something to stick around for.
however, if there were to be just 2 djs per night then it would be useful for there to be maybe not communal cds but at least for djs to share their cds with other djs so that both the djs catered for as wide as spectrum of members as possible.
i do think that sometimes the djs do tend to give in to self indulgence just as a set is beginning to rock by playing a track they personally like which sometimes clears the dancefloor. however, given that the djs do an admirable & often thankless job then i think such indulgence can usually be forgiven.
[hr][s]Skinny Puppy[/s]
the way i interpreted the original post was that there's been a certain lack of variety in the setlists & that certain songs have been played & relied upon maybe a bit too much.
i would genrally agree with this sentiment (if i've interpreted it roughly correctly) & would add that it's perhaps that there are perhaps too many staples maybe being played too often, whereby you get a set where rather a high proportion of it consists of such staples.
take bands like Guns 'n Roses & Aerosmith. both bands have turned out a significant number of classic, well known & quite danceable tracks. yet in the above cases there seems to be a tendency of playing Dude Looks Like a Lady & Paradise City whilst ignoring other perfectly good hits.
as for the listing of a few songs at the end of my 1st post, these weren't just "my favourite songs of the last five minutes". i do hope that was meant as a witty exaggeration.
what i was trying to do was suggest a number of tracks which would be suitable for playing on the dance floor, i.e. songs which rock, which are danceable & which enough folk should know (i've been to enough rock clubs to know which songs work). i was merely trying to be constructive by offering some alternative songs to the staples we usually get (like the afforementionned Chop Suey). if this came across wrong then i offer my apologies.
on to the less song-specific side of things i'd say that having 2 djs may allow there to be a smoother flow but there would be some down sides as well.
many (if not all) of the djs in RockSoc have their own distinctive style & so if you generally don't like one dj's music selections then you're sometimes limited to sitting it out for a long period of time. having three djs does offer a chance to hear a variety of dj setlists which means that whilst it might not be as good for some it does at least give other members something to stick around for.
however, if there were to be just 2 djs per night then it would be useful for there to be maybe not communal cds but at least for djs to share their cds with other djs so that both the djs catered for as wide as spectrum of members as possible.
i do think that sometimes the djs do tend to give in to self indulgence just as a set is beginning to rock by playing a track they personally like which sometimes clears the dancefloor. however, given that the djs do an admirable & often thankless job then i think such indulgence can usually be forgiven.
[hr][s]Skinny Puppy[/s]
-
benedict
Re:
by Decadence on Thu Dec 18, 2003 4:22 pm
Right, as an old DJ of yore, I feel that I have to say something now after reading all these lengthy posts...
1. I know when I used to be doing this (mostly) thankless job that I couldn't afford to have all the CDs I wanted/needed to play on Thursday nights... I tended to have a large amount of stuff that I myself listened to, and a few other things that were of a more general appeal... Given that you're all still students, I don't think anyone esle now would be willing to shell out the 13 odd quid for a cd that they're not going to listen to once they leave St Andrews... I did buy a few, but now they're rotting in the back of my cupboard somewhere... Technically now it's easier, what with downloading mp3s and suchlike, but then you still have to have access to all the equipment necessary...
2. There has been talk for the past 7 years of the comittee buying a bunch of general taste CDs for use by the DJs, and this has never happened... Why? - general apathy!!!
3. It was I who instituted the try-outs for DJs... I didn't base my selection on the ones who played songs I liked (otherwise you would all be listening to black and death metal!), but rather those who could keep the dancefloor (fairly) full, whilst still managing to avoid repeating all the tracks that I was already playing...
4. As far as I can recall, there were always 2 Djs a night... We tried to keep it so that the Djs could play what their collections contained, but by having 2 different musical tastes each night, we could provide a wider range of music rather thatn the same old stuff over and over again...
5. I know I was guilty sometimes of playing the same track by an artist over and over again, but if it's what people want to hear, then there you go... Sometimes, it's lose-lose: you play what people want, and they whinge about the fact that there's no new music, and then when you play new music, they whinge that there's nothing they know to dance to... Remember: thankless task!!!
6. Requests: this is a sticky one, ususally got round by this simple statement: If you want to hear it, bring it and we'll see what we can do... Not ideal, but it's usually the best there is...
As far as what gets played now goes, well I can't really pass comment, as the only time I've been up recently (halloween) I was too drunk to care >;}
... So, there you have some ranting from someone who's been there, done that and got the t-shirt...
D.
[hr]"Yes, I am an agent of Satan,
But my duties are largely ceremonial."
... Thus spake the Cardinal of Decadence
1. I know when I used to be doing this (mostly) thankless job that I couldn't afford to have all the CDs I wanted/needed to play on Thursday nights... I tended to have a large amount of stuff that I myself listened to, and a few other things that were of a more general appeal... Given that you're all still students, I don't think anyone esle now would be willing to shell out the 13 odd quid for a cd that they're not going to listen to once they leave St Andrews... I did buy a few, but now they're rotting in the back of my cupboard somewhere... Technically now it's easier, what with downloading mp3s and suchlike, but then you still have to have access to all the equipment necessary...
2. There has been talk for the past 7 years of the comittee buying a bunch of general taste CDs for use by the DJs, and this has never happened... Why? - general apathy!!!
3. It was I who instituted the try-outs for DJs... I didn't base my selection on the ones who played songs I liked (otherwise you would all be listening to black and death metal!), but rather those who could keep the dancefloor (fairly) full, whilst still managing to avoid repeating all the tracks that I was already playing...
4. As far as I can recall, there were always 2 Djs a night... We tried to keep it so that the Djs could play what their collections contained, but by having 2 different musical tastes each night, we could provide a wider range of music rather thatn the same old stuff over and over again...
5. I know I was guilty sometimes of playing the same track by an artist over and over again, but if it's what people want to hear, then there you go... Sometimes, it's lose-lose: you play what people want, and they whinge about the fact that there's no new music, and then when you play new music, they whinge that there's nothing they know to dance to... Remember: thankless task!!!
6. Requests: this is a sticky one, ususally got round by this simple statement: If you want to hear it, bring it and we'll see what we can do... Not ideal, but it's usually the best there is...
As far as what gets played now goes, well I can't really pass comment, as the only time I've been up recently (halloween) I was too drunk to care >;}
... So, there you have some ranting from someone who's been there, done that and got the t-shirt...
D.
[hr]"Yes, I am an agent of Satan,
But my duties are largely ceremonial."
... Thus spake the Cardinal of Decadence
-
Decadence
DJ rota
by Kytheraen on Thu Dec 18, 2003 4:57 pm
It seems to be in my job description that I am the one who organises DJs for the night. Currently we have six, and three play each night. I have started a rota system which basically is if a DJ was on 1st last time, they're on 2nd next time, 2nd = last and last = 1st etc. It doesn't however mean that every other RockSoc are the same three DJs in differing order. It's in the interests of fairness and that we don't get the same type of music at the same time each week.
-
Kytheraen
Re:
by Mark on Tue Dec 30, 2003 2:03 pm
As the President AND one of the longest-standing DJs in the society (shit...actually THE longest-standing DJ. How can that be? I'm only in 4th year, for fucks sake), I think I should probably comment on this issue.
Firstly, there have been some very good points raised. See...we can take criticism when it's constructive(!)
The problem is, they're almost all criticisms we've either made ourselves at meetings, been warned about by previous committees/DJs, or are simply well aware of. Something really should change - I couldn't agree more. Speaking purely as a Rocksoccer, if I never heard Chop Suey, Paradise City/Sweet Child, Poison, Dude Looks Like A Lady, et al ever again, I would be a happy man. Overplayed, and frankly not even all that good in some cases. BUT...I still play some of them. Why?
Well, firstly, anyone who thinks the DJs just play what they like is missing the point by a substantial margin. If I thought anyone would be assessing my taste in music by what I play at Rocksoc, I'd be horrified. Sure, a few personal favourites do occasionally sneak in, but generally, we try to play what we think you lot want to dance to. Unfortunately, the only real indicators we have for that is what you usually DO dance to (or have done in the past), and herein lieth the problem. Accepted, however, is the point that we've probably all been getting a little TOO conservative in recent months. I know for certain that I, for one, have. The reasons are manifold, and many of them boil down to the simple fact that I've been fucking busy of late, and haven't had time or energy to devote the consideration and planning to my setlists that I probably should. This is a flaw purely on my part, and I'll be trying harder in the New Year. Hopefully the other DJs will agree.
Secondly, and more importantly... as Simon pointed out, the reason the same songs get played over and over again is because they're the only fucking songs anybody dances to. I for one have been very fond of Adam Lineker's sets this year. He's managed a really interesting mix of well-known classics and newer songs of similar quality and style, as well as throwing in some great little curve-balls. The kind of sets I wish I had the nerve, time, and energy to play, to be honest. I'll be trying harder in the new year. However, see if you can guess which songs actually get any kind of response from the above list of categories? Exactly.
As far as I can make out, Rocksoc, by and large, is a deeply reactionary and, frankly, lazy society. I don't mean any offence by that...it's probably as true of me as of anyone else. After about 11pm, everyone who's likely to dance is probably so drunk that their booze-addled minds simply don't seem to respond to any music they can't remember enjoying dancing to before. There's our problem. I'd love something to be done about it, and will be attempting to make the New Year better than this first semester has been, in terms of music choice and atmosphere.
PLEASE continue posting ideas and suggestions. Believe it or not, we will try to listen, if only because it's nice to read intelligent comments rather than variations on "the committee are crap, they never listen to us, and wouldn't rocksoc be better if it was tailored to me and my 2 cunt mates anyway?" So thanks to everyone.
Overall, I don't think this year is going too badly. Attendance is up on last year, member feedback seems largely positive, and we've got a couple of great ideas for next semester. In the meantime...TRY COMING ALONG EARLIER! The first 2 and a half hours or so of Rocksoc are usually characterised by 2 key factors; a more interesting selection of tunes, and b) not a fucking soul there. You all know Rocksoc's on...try turning up before 10.30. You may just enjoy it.
Anyhoo, enough grumbling. Happy New Year, everyone. See you all soon.
ADIOS
MARK
P.S. Oh yeah, we'll be appointing new DJs soon. So that might make a difference too. Regards.
Firstly, there have been some very good points raised. See...we can take criticism when it's constructive(!)
The problem is, they're almost all criticisms we've either made ourselves at meetings, been warned about by previous committees/DJs, or are simply well aware of. Something really should change - I couldn't agree more. Speaking purely as a Rocksoccer, if I never heard Chop Suey, Paradise City/Sweet Child, Poison, Dude Looks Like A Lady, et al ever again, I would be a happy man. Overplayed, and frankly not even all that good in some cases. BUT...I still play some of them. Why?
Well, firstly, anyone who thinks the DJs just play what they like is missing the point by a substantial margin. If I thought anyone would be assessing my taste in music by what I play at Rocksoc, I'd be horrified. Sure, a few personal favourites do occasionally sneak in, but generally, we try to play what we think you lot want to dance to. Unfortunately, the only real indicators we have for that is what you usually DO dance to (or have done in the past), and herein lieth the problem. Accepted, however, is the point that we've probably all been getting a little TOO conservative in recent months. I know for certain that I, for one, have. The reasons are manifold, and many of them boil down to the simple fact that I've been fucking busy of late, and haven't had time or energy to devote the consideration and planning to my setlists that I probably should. This is a flaw purely on my part, and I'll be trying harder in the New Year. Hopefully the other DJs will agree.
Secondly, and more importantly... as Simon pointed out, the reason the same songs get played over and over again is because they're the only fucking songs anybody dances to. I for one have been very fond of Adam Lineker's sets this year. He's managed a really interesting mix of well-known classics and newer songs of similar quality and style, as well as throwing in some great little curve-balls. The kind of sets I wish I had the nerve, time, and energy to play, to be honest. I'll be trying harder in the new year. However, see if you can guess which songs actually get any kind of response from the above list of categories? Exactly.
As far as I can make out, Rocksoc, by and large, is a deeply reactionary and, frankly, lazy society. I don't mean any offence by that...it's probably as true of me as of anyone else. After about 11pm, everyone who's likely to dance is probably so drunk that their booze-addled minds simply don't seem to respond to any music they can't remember enjoying dancing to before. There's our problem. I'd love something to be done about it, and will be attempting to make the New Year better than this first semester has been, in terms of music choice and atmosphere.
PLEASE continue posting ideas and suggestions. Believe it or not, we will try to listen, if only because it's nice to read intelligent comments rather than variations on "the committee are crap, they never listen to us, and wouldn't rocksoc be better if it was tailored to me and my 2 cunt mates anyway?" So thanks to everyone.
Overall, I don't think this year is going too badly. Attendance is up on last year, member feedback seems largely positive, and we've got a couple of great ideas for next semester. In the meantime...TRY COMING ALONG EARLIER! The first 2 and a half hours or so of Rocksoc are usually characterised by 2 key factors; a more interesting selection of tunes, and b) not a fucking soul there. You all know Rocksoc's on...try turning up before 10.30. You may just enjoy it.
Anyhoo, enough grumbling. Happy New Year, everyone. See you all soon.
ADIOS
MARK
P.S. Oh yeah, we'll be appointing new DJs soon. So that might make a difference too. Regards.
-
Mark
15 posts
• Page 1 of 1
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests