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McIntosh are last in energy saving race

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McIntosh are last in energy saving race

Postby lts2 on Sun Jan 14, 2007 9:07 pm

On the notice board downstairs there are some lovely figures showing that we are using more energy than we have done last year in comparison to every other hall which have all managed to cut back, even if just by a little bit. So what is the problem?

I think its probably due to the way the residence managers (who I assume are responsible for this) are going about 'saving energy'.

Since Christmas the heating has been on less hours and not to mention the bigger issue of the water never being hot on A floor any more. It seems that they have decided to, in an attempt to win this energy saving malarky, cut back on our standard of living in hall.

Unfortunetly, my response personally to this was, one, to complain, and two, to take action like using a mini heater for the worst of the cold/leaving my PC on to warm up my room and the only way to solve the cold water problem seems to be to run the water for 10 minutes before getting in. I am sure that these actions have not being energy saving, but to be honest, I don't care enough to sacrifice having a warm shower every day.

I suggest that instead of cutting back like this that the hall do more pratical things like, getting lights on timers for the bathrooms and the like.

In terms of the most energy saving thing they could do, get bloody double glazing, the reason why we are all so cold is that the windows are so drafty and rattly!
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Re:

Postby box_of_delights on Sun Jan 14, 2007 10:29 pm

Quoting lts2 from 21:07, 14th Jan 2007
On the notice board downstairs there are some lovely figures showing that we are using more energy than we have done last year in comparison to every other hall which have all managed to cut back, even if just by a little bit. So what is the problem?

I think its probably due to the way the residence managers (who I assume are responsible for this) are going about 'saving energy'.

Since Christmas the heating has been on less hours and not to mention the bigger issue of the water never being hot on A floor any more. It seems that they have decided to, in an attempt to win this energy saving malarky, cut back on our standard of living in hall.

Unfortunetly, my response personally to this was, one, to complain, and two, to take action like using a mini heater/leaving my PC on 24hours a day to warm up my room and the only way to solve the cold water problem seems to be to run the water for 10 minutes before getting in. I am sure that these actions have not being energy saving, but to be honest, I don't care enough to sacrifice having a warm shower every day.

I suggest that instead of cutting back like this that the hall do more pratical things like, getting lights on timers for the bathrooms and the like.

In terms of the most energy saving thing they could do, get bloody double glazing, the reason why we are all so cold is that the windows are so drafty and rattly!


If you're having to run the water for ten minutes before it runs hot, then it sounds like you are ultimately getting a supply of hot water, but that there's a problem somewhere in the length of time it takes to reach the outlet. It doesn't sound as if they're reducing the amount of water heated, because that would result in no hot water being delivered, regardless of how long you waited (unless McIntosh has some sophisticated system that detects where in the building there may be hot water and draws from that each time - unlikely!).

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Re:

Postby Cain on Sun Jan 14, 2007 10:33 pm

Go down to C floor for a shower.

Then you convert electrical energy wastage into kinetic energy wastage.

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Re:

Postby pea on Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:05 am

If you have problems you should bring it up with the RMs and see if it is their fault before going and making accusations. The RMs more than anyone want energy saving technology like the light things you mentioned, but it takes money and I think they don't have enough in their allocation to afford things like that at the minute. Evelyn in particular is very keen on the recycling and energy issues so you should speak to her about it all to get the RMs point of view and see what the issues are.

As for why we're last, I'm stumped. Not much focus or "publicity" as it were has been put up about it short of an email at the start of the year and a few posters, so I think constant reminding might help. Of course that's mainly the fault of the E&E Rep/Committee and I intend to bring it up at the next meeting as it's an important issue to me personally.

But ultimately, even with many posters put up and emails going out some people are still going to ignore the suggestions or just forget about it, and that's something no one can help.

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Re:

Postby Jono on Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:19 am

There's plenty of publicity for it about. There are posters in every kitchen. I think the fact that we had the spate of all the lights in the corridors being turned off every night attests to that fact!

At the end of the day, as Leila says, we don't exactly have the most modern building, this old Edwardian(?) of ours. it'd be great if we had double glazing, etc for the whole hall, but could you imagine the logistical implications of replacing 400-odd windows. Furthermore, it's hardly a measured test considering the disparities in population size, energy saving measures, etc. between halls.

As for me, I'm quite happy to sit here in abject darkness with my heating off all day long!

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Re:

Postby Akasha on Mon Jan 15, 2007 1:32 am

From what Roger Smith said when Louise and I met him they are comparing our energy usage this year to our energy usage last year.

The winner will be the hall that has saved the most energy RELATIVE to its usage in the previous year.

So, although we may have the highest usage we could still win... mebe... :)
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Re:

Postby o_t4ng on Mon Jan 15, 2007 2:10 am

The hot water issue seems to be just A-floor... although I did notice that none of the showers down here got above warm for the last 2 weeks before Christmas...

Also my radiator has died again (yes, i have reported it) that's the 3rd time this year, so I'm getting quite used to living in Antarctic observation shelter-like conditions.

Finally, I think the fact that we're all on here at stupid o'clock in the morning might be a clue as to why we're not winning...

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Re:

Postby Wooly on Mon Jan 15, 2007 9:48 am

Quoting o_t4ng from 02:10, 15th Jan 2007
The hot water issue seems to be just A-floor... although I did notice that none of the showers down here got above warm for the last 2 weeks before Christmas...


Nope, it afflicts B-Floor as well.

I've barely noticed any sort of poster campaign, to be honest. I'm sure more could be done to advertise our energy-saving drive. I'm not so sure people would take any notice of it, but at least they have no excuse for not knowing about it.

I quite happily go about turning off all the lights if they've been left on in a room which is empty, but I get slightly demoralised when I realise that all of my work can be negated in an instant by someone leaving a shower light on once they leave the shower. It's not the most taxing thing in the world to pull a cord coming out of the bathroom, is it?

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Re:

Postby October on Mon Jan 15, 2007 2:31 pm

Quoting lts2 from 21:07, 14th Jan 2007
On the notice board downstairs there are some lovely figures showing that we are using more energy than we have done last year in comparison to every other hall which have all managed to cut back, even if just by a little bit. So what is the problem?

I think its probably due to the way the residence managers (who I assume are responsible for this) are going about 'saving energy'.

Since Christmas the heating has been on less hours and not to mention the bigger issue of the water never being hot on A floor any more. It seems that they have decided to, in an attempt to win this energy saving malarky, cut back on our standard of living in hall.

Unfortunetly, my response personally to this was, one, to complain, and two, to take action like using a mini heater/leaving my PC on 24hours a day to warm up my room and the only way to solve the cold water problem seems to be to run the water for 10 minutes before getting in. I am sure that these actions have not being energy saving, but to be honest, I don't care enough to sacrifice having a warm shower every day.

I suggest that instead of cutting back like this that the hall do more pratical things like, getting lights on timers for the bathrooms and the like.

In terms of the most energy saving thing they could do, get bloody double glazing, the reason why we are all so cold is that the windows are so drafty and rattly!


If you’re cold in your room, you put on another jumper, not buy a mini heater (which I’m sure are against the rules) and use that, wasting even more energy, and making hall even further behind in the ‘race’. So what if the heating isn’t on at all the times you want it to be on. There are worst things.

And you’re lucky to even get hot water, after 10 mins of running the hot water taps at my end of B floor, the taps run dry, and that’s not just my room.
And no matter what the RM’s try they can’t fix it. (they have tried). It’s been a problem for a few years now I think (I definitely remember the problem being there last year.)

And on the topic of getting new lights and windows.
Where do you think they’ll get the money to do so?
The Uni can only upgrade a few halls at a time.
I’m not sure, but I think it was Reggs that was fitted with energy saving motion sensors, 2 years ago, and I think it was Uni hall just fitted with them, but I could be wrong on that. They cost money you know.


So basically my point is this:
If you’re not going to do anything about cutting down the amount of energy you use, don’t complain when we’re not winning the energy saving contest.

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Re:

Postby o_t4ng on Mon Jan 15, 2007 3:24 pm

OK, normally I'm pretty restrained and let you lot get on with whatever bickering you've chosen to do for that day... but I gotta step in here...

October, you can't launch personalised attacks like that. Not on my board. I understand some of your argument, but actual name calling is not only immature and mean, but it also contravenes any 'hall spirit' you wish to promote...

So, please, by all means debate, argue if you want... just keep it on topic and leave personal feuds off this board. THIS GOES FOR EVERYONE!

Thanks.

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Re:

Postby October on Mon Jan 15, 2007 3:57 pm

Quoting o_t4ng from 15:24, 15th Jan 2007
OK, normally I'm pretty restrained and let you lot get on with whatever bickering you've chosen to do for that day... but I gotta step in here...

October, you can't launch personalised attacks like that. Not on my board. I understand some of your argument, but actual name calling is not only immature and mean, but it also contravenes any 'hall spirit' you wish to promote...

So, please, by all means debate, argue if you want... just keep it on topic and leave personal feuds off this board. THIS GOES FOR EVERYONE!

Thanks.

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This has nothing to do with my personal opinoins,
I just it very hypocritical that someone would complain that we're last in the comp, when they them self have done nothing about saving energy, and in fact are going out of there way to wast even more.

I would call that stupid, no matter who it was that said it.

And besides I have no feuds.
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Re:

Postby lts2 on Mon Jan 15, 2007 5:07 pm

It has been interesting to see what everyone else thinks.

I am out from 9-5 every day and don't spend any weekends here which I am sure makes my leaving of PC on during the night negliable.

In any case, Jon, what you said about it not being relative is kind of true, they only weight it against the previous year's usage but it is much easier for a hall with double glazing to reduce their energy costs than it is for a place like McIntosh so really it isn't that fair a contest.

Still, good idea to try and make us use less energy its just a shame it isn't working very well. I don't think it has to do with the fact that we aren't trying hard enough, I think its an intrinsic problem with the building.

I spoke to the residence managers about the hot water and it seems that it is a combination of them decreasing the heated water and some fault with the system.

The heating seems to be getting better too, but with 3 windows in my room it only takes 30 minutes after my heating switches off for my rooms to drop to 15C (yes I have a thermometer). This is officially not a habitable temperature so I think its completely acceptable for me to be doing something about that.

I think the underlying problem is that the university ask us to use less energy and yet turning lights/computers off isn't going to make a big difference. Not a lot of people realise what things use the most energy, ie the heating/cookers/hairdyers/kettles. Infact, to boil 10 cups of tea uses about the same amount of energy as if we were to leave all the lights in hall on for 24 hours. So really, the fact that we are losing could purely be due to the fact that we have more tea drinkers than last year, no matter how hard we try to cut down on our own personal energy consumption. What the university really needs to do is look at long term energy consuption reduction. Double glazing would be expensive, yes, and a mission to install, but they have the whole summer and also, they would easily make their money back in a couple of years from the lessened heat we would need. The university don't seems to think long term like this at all (typical example is continuting to build on the North Haugh even though the buildings are not going to be able to last).
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Re:

Postby October on Mon Jan 15, 2007 5:22 pm

You did say you were using a mini heater in your room. That would incress energy usage.
Also your not cutting down on your energy usage.
So Why would you want to bring up the point that we are last in the race when it is people like you putting us there?

And in response to lts2 edited post.
You are right it that the fact that the university seems to lack any form of long trem planing, and that double glazing would be nice and save money, but isn't McIntosh a listed building, so double glazing would cost even more than normal. And They can't really install it in the summer, cos if you didn't know, Mc gets used as a hotel in the summer, and doing work like that would surely cost them bussiness.

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Re:

Postby lts2 on Mon Jan 15, 2007 5:49 pm

I believe Alex's post was refering to you. I have been 'told off' for nothing. Now I suggest that you leave this.
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Re:

Postby jules on Mon Jan 15, 2007 5:52 pm

using the heater and leaving the pc on is really energy intensive. FAKT

u cant possibly argue about this, and there is no way you can justify you leaving the pc on all night for no clear reason. sry leily, but im with andrew on this one.
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Re:

Postby lts2 on Mon Jan 15, 2007 5:56 pm

Quoting lts2 from 17:07, 15th Jan 2007
Aside from Andrew's pointless post it has been interesting to see what everyone else thinks. I suggest that if Andrew has any personal issue with my energy consuption that he come and discuss it with me in person instead of bitching on the sinner about me personally. The sinner is not a forum for personal issues that he has with me. Alex, as mod this is your responsibility to fix I hope that you tell Andrew that this isn't acceptable and that he should stick to the topic of why we are losing the energy competition rather than pathetically calling someone that he can't deal with in person a 'cow' on the internet. It is highly pathetic and unacceptable.

Also Andrew should note that he has no idea how much time I spend in hall, and is actually very little. I am out from 9-5 every day and don't spend any weekends here which I am sure makes my leaving of PC on during the night negliable.

In any case, Jon, what you said about it not being relative is kind of true, they only weight it against the previous year's usage but it is much easier for a hall with double glazing to reduce their energy costs than it is for a place like McIntosh so really it isn't that fair a contest.

Still, good idea to try and make us use less energy its just a shame it isn't working very well. I don't think it has to do with the fact that we aren't trying hard enough, I think its an intrinsic problem with the building.

I spoke to the residence managers about the hot water and it seems that it is a combination of them decreasing the heated water and some fault with the system.

The heating seems to be getting better too, but with 3 windows in my room it only takes 30 minutes after my heating switches off for my rooms to drop to 15C (yes I have a thermometer). This is officially not a habitable temperature so I think its completely acceptable for me to be doing something about that. In any case the heating seems to be a lot better this week even though its much more windy.

I think the underlying problem is that the university ask us to use less energy and yet turning lights/computers off isn't going to make a big difference. Not a lot of people realise what things use the most energy, ie the heating/cookers/hairdyers/kettles. Infact, to boil 10 cups of tea uses about the same amount of energy as if we were to leave all the lights in hall on for 24 hours. So really, the fact that we are losing could purely be due to the fact that we have more tea drinkers than last year, no matter how hard we try to cut down on our own personal energy consumption. What the university really needs to do is look at long term energy consuption reduction. Double glazing would be expensive, yes, and a mission to install, but they have the whole summer and also, they would easily make their money back in a couple of years from the lessened heat we would need. The university don't seems to think long term like this at all (typical example is continuting to build on the North Haugh even though the buildings are not going to be able to last).
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Re:

Postby lts2 on Mon Jan 15, 2007 5:59 pm

I justify leaving my PC on because if I don't then at 6am or whenever the heating turns off in the morning it drops to a temperature in my room that is too cold to be in. I have three very drafty windows and without any heating at this time of year it is frankly too cold. But like I said already the heating seems to be a lot better this week so I haven't had to resort to leaving my PC on to keep the room at an ok temperature.
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Re:

Postby theshark on Mon Jan 15, 2007 6:24 pm

Ok, i think we all need to chill the fook out...

Firstly, Leila isn't complaining about the fact that we are last in the energy race, but about the way that people have gone about tackling this, which is fair enough, I'd be pretty fuckin' angry if I had to live/sleep in a freezing cold room...and leaving a PC on uses up less energy as most people think...little things like this make a difference, sure, but a long term solution is much better, even with the cost...I know that I'd prefer to go without a few hall events if it meant that we had a warm hall...

Secondly, if a certain someone has a problem with a certain someone else, being bitchy and name-calling on the Sinner is only going to make matters worse, either talk it out, or if thats not a possibility, just don't talk to them, it'll just agitate the situation...
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Re:

Postby October on Mon Jan 15, 2007 6:53 pm

Quoting theshark from 18:24, 15th Jan 2007
Secondly, if a certain someone has a problem with a certain someone else, being bitchy and name-calling on the Sinner is only going to make matters worse, either talk it out, or if thats not a possibility, just don't talk to them, it'll just agitate the situation...


I tryed the last one, but after several rumors and lies being spread about me by a certin person, It seems not to work all that well.
I had hope that this certin person would grow up and stop doing so, but if what've heard from last week is anything to go by it would seem not.

And on the issue of the small things using up power. Something on stand by uses a lager % (about 75-80%) of the power it would use being on.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6075794.stm
So if you have a TV in your room or anything like that in fact.
It's best just to switch them off than putting them on stand by.
And if for what ever reason, you wre to feel the need to put on exter heating while you sleep. Might I surgest haveing another duvet,
this will keep you warm and with no need to use something that will cost energy.

It's shame we are last. some of us are trying really hard to cut down on energy. I guess we'll just have to try harder and get the message across to even more people who are not saveing energy.

A good way, of starting small is if you leave you room for a weekend(or any exented time ie sky week) make sure everything is off at the plugs.
It maybe a small start, but it's a start. And one in the right direction.
For a bbc artical on energy saving.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6076658.stm

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Re:

Postby o_t4ng on Mon Jan 15, 2007 7:19 pm

I agree with Andrew about the heating issues... there are better ways to stay warm than leaving your PC on over night... I don't want to sound like a hypocrite, cos I do that too... but I'm usually on my PC all night, it's not quite the same. You are correct in stating that appliances on stand-by use stupid amounts of energy and just cos someone is too lazy to turn them off properly are costing a lot in energy and money.
It is definitely a case of every little helps... I try as much as I can... turning lights off if I find them on with noone around, turning off unused sockets, at least I switch off my PC monitor (which accounts for something like 75% of all energy consumption for a PC) when I leave the room.

The poster campaign was pretty extensive, but a lot more could have been done to promote the competition... or at least make it into something people wanted to be a part of... Although, personally, I think people should want to help the planet without needing incentives... but, hey, I'm an idealist...

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