Not got the results needed

[Mr Comedy]

Quoting from 01:54, 10th Jun 2006
doesnt that depend on whether you are going into honours, are in honours, or are graduating.

I feel very sorry for those graduating with less than a 2.1, I did - I had a great CV apart from a 2.2 only know with a year in work have i recovered and only through work exp due to connections.

A 2.2 screws you, you simply wont get a graduate job with a 2.2, most will end up with deadend jobs for 20k or jobs with a future for 10k. A 2.1 with no work exp isnt great either. for help i had work exp with multi national organisations abroad at a very senior level highly relevant to the sector i wanted to work in.

A 2.1 is what you need. Believe me a 2.2 is a failure that makes the difference between a wicked job in london with mates or job in london with no spare cash or a job in the provinces earning a pittance - you can of course earn more if you are prepared to take a job and earn 20 to 30k for the rest of your life - bear in mind that 20k will get you a mortgage for 60k if you lay down a 10 to 20 % deposit - so not a great place for a graduate to be. Get a 2.1 and you can motor - can emphasise that enough.

That's the biggest load of horse shit I've ever heard. I graduated last year with a 2.2 in Geography, and I have a quality job on sigificantly more money than that in the City. My career has not been harmed in any way by getting a 2.2. I was also involved in all kinds of stuff at uni - I had a whole page on what I had done as well as my degree, which powered me through the interview process. Yeah, if you want to work for McKinsey or some banks you'll never go anywhere with a 2.2, and some companies will only employ 2.1/1st class candidates, but this is not the rule. I don't believe that I would earn more now or later in my career with a 2.1 or a 1st class.

[hr]

"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung

[Sid]

I couldn't give a shit, degree shmegree! I'm just glad it's all over. I just feel as though I've got a gold star, it deserves a smile and a night on the piss then that's it, time to get on with life.

[Humphrey]

Quoting Mr Comedy from 13:21, 12th Jun 2006

That's the biggest load of horse shit I've ever heard. I graduated last year with a 2.2 in Geography, and I have a quality job on sigificantly more money than that in the City. My career has not been harmed in any way by getting a 2.2. I was also involved in all kinds of stuff at uni - I had a whole page on what I had done as well as my degree, which powered me through the interview process. Yeah, if you want to work for McKinsey or some banks you'll never go anywhere with a 2.2, and some companies will only employ 2.1/1st class candidates, but this is not the rule. I don't believe that I would earn more now or later in my career with a 2.1 or a 1st class.

Agreed. I think the mistake a lot of people make is to assume that a 2:1 will guarentee them a good job. Most people I know have struggled after uni because they lack experience. I know the frustration of this because you get stuck in a vicious circle whereby you need experience to get a role that get you experience but you lack the necessary experience to get the experience. Now I would strongly question whether experience is a necessary prerequsite for a bog standard admin position since you can train a monkey to do the same role in about a couple of days. A lot of people I know struggled after uni - me included for five months of temping hell in Nottingham - but it always seems to work out for everyone in the end.

[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/humphrey_clarke/

[Jam-bo]

I think that the point of any degree is showing an intellectual interest in a subject that can be relatively translated into interest into a job. In effect a degree is a fictive ticket to ride. To hold a 2.i as opposed to a 2.ii. simply allows one to 'queue jump'. It will get you to the interview quicker, but won't get you the job. A friend of mine has a 2.ii in chemistry and his advice to me was "whatever you do, don't get a 2.ii.... It took me ages to get a job". He now holds a good position at Proctor and Gamble and travels the world.

As for experience, I'm not so convinced. One of the most beneficial parts of those labourious train journeys south was speaking to a pair of recruitment specialists. They said that all they wanted to hear was what someone can do, not what they may be able to learn or have had the opportunity to do in some mundane, two-a-penny, internship.

Personally I'm happy to have got my 2.i as I want to do postgraduate study, but on the whole I don't think it matters much...

[md25]

A better degree class means you are more likely to get interviews. It does not mean you'll be any better at interview. I had an MSci first-class with no real skills and no real experience, so I had lots of interviews that I fluffed out of.

There is a reason all the annoying successful people did lots of stuff at uni. I managed to wing a PhD studentship elsewhere somehow, and man, I'm making sure my CV's going to be padded like nothing else when I finish this degree.

[JM]

i still havent got a grade back and there no "Z" or anything. do you reckon i should email the dept or leave it knowing i'll et it eventually

[hr]

"Life can be full of many problems"; this can be translated into "tormenting you is how the big man gets his jollies"

[Gealle]

Well, I don't have this year's dates; however there is usually a date declared, by which all results must be confirmed to faculties office. If your results haven't been okied and posted, I'd start bitching to the department.

Fingers crossed it all works out and was just a technical mishap

[Mr Comedy]

Quoting Jam-bo from 15:27, 12th Jun 2006
I think that the point of any degree is showing an intellectual interest in a subject that can be relatively translated into interest into a job. In effect a degree is a fictive ticket to ride. To hold a 2.i as opposed to a 2.ii. simply allows one to 'queue jump'. It will get you to the interview quicker, but won't get you the job. A friend of mine has a 2.ii in chemistry and his advice to me was "whatever you do, don't get a 2.ii.... It took me ages to get a job". He now holds a good position at Proctor and Gamble and travels the world.

As for experience, I'm not so convinced. One of the most beneficial parts of those labourious train journeys south was speaking to a pair of recruitment specialists. They said that all they wanted to hear was what someone can do, not what they may be able to learn or have had the opportunity to do in some mundane, two-a-penny, internship.

Personally I'm happy to have got my 2.i as I want to do postgraduate study, but on the whole I don't think it matters much...

Jambo, I'm a recruitment specialist - I headhunt traders for banks and trading houses among other things, and I'm one of the leading recruiters for most of the investment banks and trading houses in London. Having said that, I don't do much graduate recruitment. But if any St Andrews grads want a job in the City in energy trading, send me your CV this week (d.vinton@huxley.com), as I have a couple of grad roles on at the moment. Particularly keen to hear from people with Business Studies and Economics degrees. £25k base + benefits. Ahem...

People would much rather see someone who has been involved in some club, interest, sport etc at university instead of sitting on their arse. Believe me, I recruit for these dudes all day long, and this is something they are interested in. It also gives you something to talk about in the interview, as opposed to the 2.1 student who sat in most of the time and didn't have any exciting extra-curricular interests. I got a 2.2 and it took me nearly 2 weeks to get a job. I also recieved 5 offers. I would heavily advise the following for those looking for jobs:

1. Get your CV out there asap to as many recruitment consultants and job adverts as possible. So many grads waste time applying to just 2 or 3 companies. And then wonder why they are still temping in 12 months. You've missed the boat.

2. Apply to lots of different jobs, ideally all in the same location.

3. Work on your interview questions:

a. "Where have you worked as part of a team"
b. "Tell me a bit more about yourself"
c. "Why are you interested in this company"
d. "What interests you in this sector" etc.

4. Bear in mind that virtually every graduate in the country from a good university applies for one of the following:
- Investment Banking
- Management Consulting

Finally, if anyone wants a job in recruitment then drop me an email with your CV and I'll have a chat to you. If you are interested in the jobs above, drop me a line too.

[hr]

"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung

[Mr Comedy]

Oh, and as an addendum, learning to interview is a skill in itself, as you are selling yourself as a commodity to the business. I bombed out on my first 4 interviews. 10 common interview questions folks:

1. Why do you want to work here?
2. What did you like/dislike about your last job?
3. What would you like to be doinq five years from now?
4. What are your biggest accomplishments?
5. Can you work under pressure?
6. Why should I hire you?
7. How do you take direction?
8. Tell me about yourself.
9. What is the most difficult situation you have faced?
10. Do you prefer workinq with others or alone?

Oh, and finally, research the company - at the least look at their website in detail and do a google news search. Why would they take you on if you can't be arsed to find out what they do?

[hr]

"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung

[joug]

What's the answer to question 3?

I reckon I can do the rest but really... what sort of answer are they expecting? As in - where in the company hierarchy? Or as in - where in the world? With what sort of responsibilities? That's a tough one, and as I will be doing all the applying come Sept it would be great to know!

[Mr Comedy]

A good answer to Question 3 would be

"Ideally in five years time I would like to have substantially developed my understanding of the company and the industry, and be playing an integral role in the company and its performance. To have developed new skills, abilities, maturity - perhaps a little wisdom even. To have become better qualified in whatever way suits the situation and opportunities I have. To be better regarded by my peers, and respected by my superiors as someone who can continue to increase the value and scale of what I do for the organisation."

A large amount of bullshit in that answer, but essentially say that you are keen to develop and grow with the company, and naturally as a result you'd be keen to take on more responsibility.

[hr]

"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung

[Jam-bo]

Looks like I've been shot across the bow!

I've been sunk, but before I go down I just wanted to point out what I have been told on one occasion... and my own personal opinion.

Sorry if i have encroached on your territory, Mr. Comedy, won't do it again boss...

As a point of interest though, how do 'recruitment specialists' cut through the crap, sifting out the morons who had 'internships' arranged through contacts, completed a bullshit degree, scraped a 2.i and couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery? (YOU KNOW THESE PEOPLE EXIST... I know people who have got away with murder at st andrews whilst others had to work)

[Mr Comedy]

We give them a quick call and figure out if they are duffers or not.

[hr]

"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung

[Humphrey]

Quoting Mr Comedy from 13:14, 13th Jun 2006
We give them a quick call and figure out if they are duffers or not.

[hr]

"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung

How are you recruiting these guys Comedy?. Do you just cold call the blighters and offer them a shit load of cash?.

[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/humphrey_clarke/

[flarewearer]

People who say you need at least a 2:i to get anywhere in life are either liars or idiots, or both. Look at the Queen; hasn't got a degree, never even went to school and ended up driving trucks for the ATS. Didn't stop her rising to the top, did it?

[hr]

[Humphrey]

Quoting Jam-bo from 00:36, 13th Jun 2006
As a point of interest though, how do 'recruitment specialists' cut through the crap, sifting out the morons who had 'internships' arranged through contacts, completed a bullshit degree, scraped a 2.i and couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery? (YOU KNOW THESE PEOPLE EXIST... I know people who have got away with murder at st andrews whilst others had to work)

Sounds a lot like me, which would explain why I avoid recruitment specialists. I should point out that not being able to organise a piss up in a brewery does not prevent you from doing well in business. Around half the people I deal with from major organisations on a day to day basis have no idea what they are doing. We do live in something of a meritocracy but luckily merit is very rare indeed.

[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/humphrey_clarke/

[Jam-bo]

Quoting Humphrey from 13:24, 13th Jun 2006


Sounds a lot like me, which would explain why I avoid recruitment specialists. I should point out that not being able to organise a piss up in a brewery does not prevent you from doing well in business. Around half the people I deal with from major organisations on a day to day basis have no idea what they are doing. We do live in something of a meritocracy but luckily merit is very rare indeed.

[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/humphrey_clarke/

That's why this country is going to the dogs! Dogs I say!

Seriously some industries must be bubbling to the point of collapse through ineptitude... I mean... look at the government.

[Rilla]

I think this is really interesting. Maybe I'm just being ignorant, but I always wonder, what do people who work in investment banking or consultancy or whatever actually DO?

Would they hire me? I've no clue about what people who work in the "city" actually do, day to day.


[hr]

Be good to yourself because nobody else has the power to make you happy.

[Midget]

Quoting Rilla from 13:43, 13th Jun 2006
I've no clue about what people who work in the "city" actually do, day to day.

coke

[hr]

IMAGE:img9.imgspot.com/u/04/241/18/160019.jpg "Little!"
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37100090

[Guest]

Has anyone had the experience of not getting the marks to get in to honours but then being allowed in?