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NUS are at it again

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NUS are at it again

Postby David Bean on Thu Dec 01, 2005 12:50 pm

This was something I forgot to post about last week, but got a bit tied up. Ben Reilly and I used to belong to this mailing list called STADIA, which is a forum for sharing best practice with student officers around the country in the field of student activities. When we signed up, whilst the ownership of the list by the NUS was mentioned, there was no restriction as to who could join.

Recently, however, I got involved in quite a heated discussion on the role of student societies. A number of the (NUS affiliated) officers were apparently of the belief that associations should operate as some kind of communist regime, funding societies primarily because of their ability to promote all sorts of woolly 'shared values' belonging to the association itself. I, on the other hand, said that people should view societies as we do in St Andrews - as arms of the Association capable of providing a micro-managed service to their student members - and fund them purely (though within obvious constraints) on the basis of their ability to provide services that students actually want to enjoy. A number of people emailed me and said, yeah, right on, we're sick of all this ridiculous Stalinist bureaucracy too.

So what happened? The bastards kicked us off the list! Not even a word of warning - just zip, that's it, no thanks for coming. So I emailed the administrator to enquire politely as to why we'd been dumped, and can you guess what they said? We were expelled because St Andrews isn't in the NUS!

I mean, come off it - it's a mailing list, for goodness sake. We'd been contributing quite happily, giving them their two cents; I'd even contacted some of the members privately to help them with some queries they had. But nope, the fact that we're not in the NUS means we're apparently not worthy to bask in the glow of their majestic presence. Whatever happened to the free and fair exchange of ideas?

The kicker is, they appended to their response something along the lines of, "If you would like to contact us regarding affiliation, we should be pleased to discuss it". Yeah, because my first thought in being kicked off was "Oh, I'd really love to spend £20,000 of the students' money to stay on your crappy mailing list"! :)

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Re:

Postby DrAlex on Thu Dec 01, 2005 12:55 pm

Quoting David Bean from 12:50, 1st Dec 2005
Whatever happened to the free and fair exchange of ideas?


The NUS happened...

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Re:

Postby papercutheart on Thu Dec 01, 2005 1:00 pm

Quoting David Bean from 12:50, 1st Dec 2005
Whatever happened to the free and fair exchange of ideas?


They are not members of the NUS! They are, therefore, banned from peaking their heads out from above the masses.

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Re:

Postby Dave the Explosive Newt on Thu Dec 01, 2005 2:02 pm

It seems to me the obvious solution is to start something similar - message boards aren't that hard to set up - and run it independantly yourself.


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Re:

Postby bananaman on Thu Dec 01, 2005 3:26 pm

Quoting Dave the Explosive Newt from 14:02, 1st Dec 2005
It seems to me the obvious solution is to start something similar - message boards aren't that hard to set up - and run it independantly yourself.



Yeah, if you have the earlier emails can't you just send one email round to everyone saying that you are going to start another, NUS neutral one, and for anyone with an interest to email you?
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Re:

Postby Bryn on Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:37 pm

I've had similar arguments with NUS affiliated Sabbaticals online before, and it does irritate me when they get so self-righteous and trying to share the NUS-love.

Hmm... self-righteous seems to be my word of the day.

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Re:

Postby flarewearer on Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:43 pm

If the NUS suddenly dissapeared in a tragic and horiffically painful incident, it's comforting to know that the world would go on exactly as usual without them. Perhaps it might even be a better place, who knows, it's not for me to say.

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Sounds like you've been having secret conversations with the NUS!

Postby Bonnie on Thu Dec 01, 2005 5:51 pm

I think this is just a rouse, Beano. I think that you've really been discussing with the NUS about how we can affiliate. To cover your tracks and to excuse the phone calls, you've made up this story.

You'd have to be a pretty stupid guy (badoom-ching) to try to pull the wool over our eyes.
[/inside joke aboue our friend at Glasgow who's recently resigned because he was talking to the NUS about affiliating]

They're just jealous at how well our societies/ subcommittees system works. Many St Andrews students may not realise how our system and the number of events we're able to put on are the envy of other unions. (At least the ones who have had a chance to see it despite the gag orders.)

Did you ever hear the story about the union thrown out of the national conference for eating fish suppers and offering to pick up more orders for other unions? They were deemed too capitalist, and thus unfriendly, to attend.

Honestly.


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Re:

Postby The Dude on Thu Dec 01, 2005 6:08 pm

Generally on this point how many independent unions are there left in the UK? Obviously there are the ones affiliate with Chess but are there any others floating about other places? I know very little about these things but how hard would it be to set up an alternative union to the NUS? It seems that there are quite a few associations across the country who are dissatisfied with the NUS but could part of the reason that they stay with it is because there are no other viable alternatives? My understanding is that St. Andrews is fairly powerful. How hard would it be to say expand Chess into England (obviously changing the acronym) or starting and new organization entirely?
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Re:

Postby Guest on Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:39 pm

Quoting The Dude from 18:08, 1st Dec 2005
How hard would it be to say expand Chess into England (obviously changing the acronym) or starting and new organization entirely?


Oh, there's got to be a way to make that organisation's acronym CHEESE...
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Re:

Postby Prophet Tenebrae on Fri Dec 02, 2005 4:56 am

Yes, the might of 7,000ish students compared to many unis who have twice that.

The problem with saying "let's start a whole new thing" is kind of like that of economic problem of markets. Sure, ideally people can enter and leave when it suits them - real world, there are costs, problems etc. that the NUS doesn't have to face, the way things are headed - it seems - the NUS will be the best option. I mean, if St. Andrews ends up BEING CHESS and not just part of it... is there really any choice?

I know there are a whole RAFT of reasons why the NUS is bad - but at the end of the day, if the average student can walk into the union and get a pint 10p cheaper if the Union is NUS and not part of some fallen alliance, honestly what do you think they'll care about more? The long term future of the Uni - which students have no vested interest in - or, how cheap their booze is on Friday, something they tangibly benefit from week in week out.

And really Bonnie - shouldn't you be in Hack re-hab by now? Or the debriefing or whatever they do for Hack withdrawl?

Glossy, glossy coat though - hurray.

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Re:

Postby flarewearer on Fri Dec 02, 2005 8:40 am

Quoting Prophet Tenebrae from 04:56, 2nd Dec 2005
And really Bonnie - shouldn't you be in Hack re-hab by now? Or the debriefing or whatever they do for Hack withdrawl?


The term you are looking for is "deprogramming"

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Re:

Postby David Bean on Fri Dec 02, 2005 2:33 pm

Quoting Bonnie from 17:51, 1st Dec 2005
I think this is just a rouse, Beano. I think that you've really been discussing with the NUS about how we can affiliate. To cover your tracks and to excuse the phone calls, you've made up this story.


Actually, you've hit the nail right on the head. I even admitted as much on another (the me-bashing) thread: I put down in my MeetingMaker that I was going to the St Andrews Festival meeting yesterday morning, when I was actually having a secret meeting with Mel Ward. Yes indeed, and I covered my tracks well, too - even forged four pages of minutes for a meeting that never happened! And I'd have got away with it, too, if it hadn't been for those pesky kids...

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Re:

Postby Midget on Fri Dec 02, 2005 3:45 pm

Quoting David Bean from 14:33, 2nd Dec 2005
And I'd have got away with it, too, if it hadn't been for those pesky kids...



*pulls off David Bean mask to reveal...*

...

[img]http://i01-4.facebook.com/pics/1/6/n36806144_6997.jpg[/img]

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Re:

Postby flarewearer on Fri Dec 02, 2005 3:54 pm

Is there a shop where one can buy Bean and / or Marco masks? I'd like to get a few for scaring the kids round here.

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Re:

Postby Midget on Fri Dec 02, 2005 5:01 pm

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Re:

Postby Marco Biagi on Fri Dec 02, 2005 6:35 pm

Stop the masks. Stop them NOW. Otherwise there might end up being some bizarre sexualised tangent to the discussion, and neither I nor Bonnie want to go in that direction. Although there was that cute NUS Treasurer once that I would have been happy to... ANYWAY, yeah, what I just said.

Oh, and ten pence cheaper? That'll be lucky.

And do you think that, had the situation been reversed, the average St Andrews hack would have acted any differently to 'socialist upstarts' or whatever they would call them on a similar mailing list they ran?

The NUS is full of wankers. But so is the Students' Association.
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Re:

Postby Steveo on Fri Dec 02, 2005 6:37 pm

No more so than the year 2002-2003.

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Re:

Postby Ben Reilly on Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:04 pm

Quoting Marco Biagi from 18:35, 2nd Dec 2005
The NUS is full of wankers. But so is the Students' Association.


True, but life is full of wankers.

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Re:

Postby Midget on Sat Dec 03, 2005 10:50 am

Quoting Marco Biagi from 18:35, 2nd Dec 2005
bizarre sexualised tangent to the discussion


What the fuck is a sexualised tangent? The use of bizarre seems unnecessary. Are sexualised tangents something they do in Oxford?

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