Fiona Hyslop: Cabinet Secretary for Education and Lifelong Learning

[Dave the Explosive Newt]

So she's running the show in Scotland now.

http://www.fionahyslop.com/EZEdit/view.asp?MID=91

Scrapping the grad endowment is all very well but I wonder what will happen to the fees us poor rest-of-UK students are paying? Whether their priority will be to protect places for Scottish students (as I imagine) or to lure the best and brightest up here... In any case, if the SNP did get their way and Scotland got independence (unlikely in the immediate future I realise) then rest-of-UK students would pay the same as Scots anyway...

[hr]

Mmmmmmm, cake.
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37102114

[A66]

Quoting Dave the Explosive Newt from 09:55, 17th May 2007
So she's running the show in Scotland now.

http://www.fionahyslop.com/EZEdit/view.asp?MID=91

Scrapping the grad endowment is all very well but I wonder what will happen to the fees us poor rest-of-UK students are paying? Whether their priority will be to protect places for Scottish students (as I imagine) or to lure the best and brightest up here... In any case, if the SNP did get their way and Scotland got independence (unlikely in the immediate future I realise) then rest-of-UK students would pay the same as Scots anyway...

[hr]

Mmmmmmm, cake.
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37102114

If Scotland became independent, we would all become 'EU' students and not have to pay.

[Dave the Explosive Newt]

Quoting A66 from 10:09, 17th May 2007

Quoting Dave the Explosive Newt from 09:55, 17th May 2007
So she's running the show in Scotland now.

http://www.fionahyslop.com/EZEdit/view.asp?MID=91

Scrapping the grad endowment is all very well but I wonder what will happen to the fees us poor rest-of-UK students are paying? Whether their priority will be to protect places for Scottish students (as I imagine) or to lure the best and brightest up here... In any case, if the SNP did get their way and Scotland got independence (unlikely in the immediate future I realise) then rest-of-UK students would pay the same as Scots anyway...

[hr]

Mmmmmmm, cake.
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37102114

If Scotland became independent, we would all become 'EU' students and not have to pay.

Which is I think what I said... I think independance is still some way off though.

[hr]

Mmmmmmm, cake.
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37102114

[McK]

I predict that Fiona Hyslop - who is a nasty piece of work (but then I would say that, wouldn't I? - will be a disastrous Education Minister. Her plans are ill-conceived and will be to the detriment of Scotland's universities. Abolishing fees and the graduate endowment simply makes higher education up here the poor relation of the rest of the institutions in the UK. It's just populist nonsense.

[exnihilo]

I'm particularly fond of the promise to wipe out debts if, and only if, you're in Scotland still. If you got a degree and went off to get a job somewhere else in the country of your birth, say in the single most likely place for you to end up as a graduate - London, you will be penalised. Genius.

[Nickel]

I wonder if the scrapping of the Graduate Endowment will be retroactive. One of the payment options for it was to add it onto your existing debt to the Student Loans Company. Presumably the people who took that option will now be having it paid for them when the debt is written off; but what happens to the people who paid it as a lump sum?

--
nickel

[Rilla]

Quoting exnihilo from 12:17, 17th May 2007
I'm particularly fond of the promise to wipe out debts if, and only if, you're in Scotland still. If you got a degree and went off to get a job somewhere else in the country of your birth, say in the single most likely place for you to end up as a graduate - London, you will be penalised. Genius.

Well, it makes sense for Scotland - sort of rewarding the highly qualified graduates who choose to stay here, and freeing up incomes here so graduates have more disposable income to spend in Scotland, thus helping Scotland's economy.

[hr]

Be good to yourself because nobody else has the power to make you happy.

[ascii]

Quoting exnihilo from 12:17, 17th May 2007
I'm particularly fond of the promise to wipe out debts if, and only if, you're in Scotland still. If you got a degree and went off to get a job somewhere else in the country of your birth, say in the single most likely place for you to end up as a graduate - London, you will be penalised. Genius.

Keeping graduates in Scotland should benefit the economy. If there's a limited amount of money to spend, then I don't think the 'Scotland resident only' thing is too bad an idea.

Indeed, I would extend the relief to rest of UK graduates staying in Scotland, before Scottish domiciled graduates living elsewhere.

A Scottish graduate moving to London will be no worse off under the new proposals than before May 3, so I would question your use of the word 'penalised'.

[ascii]

Quoting McK from 12:08, 17th May 2007
Fiona Hyslop - who is a nasty piece of work

Why?

[Humphrey]

Tons of graduates, me included, would stay in Scotland if there were enough graduate level jobs there. There aren't so we don't.

Fact is there are only about 60,000 to 80,000 true graduate jobs annually in the economy, compared to 400,000 graduates. About two thirds of them are down here in London and the south east. Much as I like this city, given the choice I wouldnt live here because its overcrowded, expensive and large parts of it look like the surface of the death star, but when you are the bottom of the career ladder you have to be an economic migrant like everyone else.


[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/humphrey_clarke/

[Dave the Explosive Newt]

Yeah, we've always been against golden handcuffs too. If they want people to stay up here then they need to create plentiful and worthwhile job opportunities.

[hr]

Mmmmmmm, cake.
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37102114

[Rilla]

Quoting Dave the Explosive Newt from 16:25, 17th May 2007
Yeah, we've always been against golden handcuffs too. If they want people to stay up here then they need to create plentiful and worthwhile job opportunities.

Is that the royal We?

[hr]

Be good to yourself because nobody else has the power to make you happy.

[exnihilo]

Thanks to being on dial-up I've been beaten to it. If the SNP wants graduates to stay in Scotland then they need to dramatically increase the number of real graduate jobs available to them, otherwise they will go elsewhere with or without the bribe/penalty. As for boosting the economy, sure, to an extent, but it is all still one economy and a proportion of whatever Scottish graduates pay in tax in London still makes its way back here - and given the disparity in earnings, it probably results in a net gain for Scotland. Not to worry, though, there are sure to be plenty of civil service and other state funded posts created soon enough - that'll do the economy of Scotland the power of good.

[Dave the Explosive Newt]

Quoting Rilla from 16:27, 17th May 2007

Quoting Dave the Explosive Newt from 16:25, 17th May 2007
Yeah, we've always been against golden handcuffs too. If they want people to stay up here then they need to create plentiful and worthwhile job opportunities.

Is that the royal We?

[hr]

Be good to yourself because nobody else has the power to make you happy.

British Medical Association in Scotland... we're talking about medical jobs but it applies to all areas.

[hr]

Mmmmmmm, cake.
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37102114

[oddly familiar]

Quoting A66 from 10:09, 17th May 20077102114

If Scotland became independent, we would all become 'EU' students and not have to pay.

I was reading something recently that suggested that come independance, Scotland would have to apply for EU membership - it wouldnt be automatically a member state like a lot of separatists seem to assume. Scotland would have to apply along with the next set of countries to join. In addition to that; Spain might try to veto Scotland's inclusion into the EU as a warning to Catalonia not to try the same independance thang.

I thought that was interesting.

[hr]

saru mo ki kara ochiru

[David Bean]

I don't believe it's up to the government to create jobs, graduate or otherwise, but if they continue to pursue economic policies that make Scotland an unattractive place for businesses to locate, they can hardly expect the jobs to follow. Similarly, if they are going to abolish the endowment for graduates who choose to remain in Scotland, why should those who feel that their careers and lives would be better served by a move somewhere else in the UK be penalised? I moved to England because the job I wanted, and got, was located here; had it been in Scotland, that's where I'd be now. If it is he SNP's position that the endowment was incorrect and should be reversed, how can it be fair to exclude a certain proportion of Scottish graduates from the reversal on the basis that their destinies lay elsewhere?

[hr]

Psalm 91:7

[exnihilo]

Because you're in the employ of the bastard English?

(Kidding!)

[David Bean]

Naturally. The way things are going, I'm expecting to be banned from setting foot back in Scotland any day now...

[hr]

Psalm 91:7

[TCT]

Quoting David Bean from 20:22, 17th May 2007
Naturally. The way things are going, I'm expecting to be banned from setting foot back in Scotland any day now...

[hr]

Psalm 91:7

At last a reason to be thankful that the SNP are in power.

[rob 'f*ck off' wine boy]

The Bean Act. Has a nice ring to it.