The Robe is Free

[Steveo]

I think he knows that, being the student support officer at the time.

[hr]

Get off my internet.

[Ewan Husami]

Well why didn't he write that then?

Or is this another case of0 "writing one thing, but meaning another, and expecting everyone to know what's going on"?

[exnihilo]

They didn't "remove permission" to rent space. They threw them out. Renting space in the Union is not some fundamental right that needed to be revoked. In throwing them out of the building they effectively shut them down. What's the problem?

[Ewan Husami]

There have been plenty of publications which operate from people's houses, rooms or even out of sheds.
Moving from one location to another doesn't shut down a publication.

If there are conditions by which an organisation must abide, in order to rent a room from a company, and they break those conditions, then permission is withdrawn.
You could call it "throwing them out", but either way, The Saint retained all their equipment and staff, and could continue operations.

The Union didn't shut down the Saint.

[poiple]

Quoting Steveo from 09:08, 21st Apr 2008

Quoting Hobo from 01:08, 21st Apr 2008

Quoting 4???2 from 18:17, 20th Apr 2008
Yes but the saint is dire, and in my day used to fabricate evidence for stories it wanted to run...

In your day? How is this relevant to the Saint in 2008?

The first bit, "the saint is dire" still applies to 2008, even if the second bit doesn't.

[hr]

Get off my internet.

This is hilarious, history repeats itself over and over again...why can't any newspaper /magazine be discusses here without The Saint feeling it OWNS St Andrews and therefore any discussion about journalism in St Andrews must involve The Saint. Was the original question not about The Robe?

What part of independent includes being bailed out perpetually by the union, 'using' not renting union property and stifling growth of other student media. The Saint shoudl be ashamed, better still The Saint should make its account and infrastructure available through FOI...

Looking forward to hearing more about The Robe, good luck to them! ...

[akeenan]

This is hilarious, history repeats itself over and over again...why can't any newspaper /magazine be discusses here without The Saint feeling it OWNS St Andrews and therefore any discussion about journalism in St Andrews must involve The Saint. Was the original question not about The Robe?

What part of independent includes being bailed out perpetually by the union, 'using' not renting union property and stifling growth of other student media. The Saint shoudl be ashamed, better still The Saint should make its account and infrastructure available through FOI...

Looking forward to hearing more about The Robe, good luck to them! ...

This is one of the most ridiculous assertions I have ever read on The Sinner. The Saint feels it "owns" St Andrews? Not a SINGLE representative of The Saint has posted on this thread - and even I don't speak for The Saint now, as I no longer hold an elected position in it. The Saint was mentioned in this argument - but not by any of its writers or staff, so what on earth makes you write such nonsense?

Also: when exactly did the Union bail out The Saint? Using not renting, eh - read the rental contract recently?

Stifling growth of other student media - nonsense. The Saint has been nothing but supportive to STAR FM, and they had no part in the demise of any other student media. The Vine stopped due to limits in what it could cover (ie political viewpoints) due to Union rules, and also due to a lack of financial viability, I believe. The Chihuahua essentially committed suicide with a particularly controversial issue, and funding was withdrawn. So how exactly did The Saint stifle anyone?

As for making accounts available through FOI - ever thought of actually asking The Saint? They don't have to show you them - they're independent, remember? - but the Union's ones are available. Read them - and marvel at the lack of 'bailouts' to The Saint, or any mention at all outside of the rent they pay. The Saint makes money from advertising. It spends money on printing. That's it.

To sum up:you're talking out of your arse. The Saint did not take part in this discussion, or jump in and mention itself. Your ideas of their financial situation and relationship with the Union are idiotic. Accusing them of 'stifling' other media is laughable.

No other student group at this University except possibly the KK and Lumsden Club has the same amount of baseless nonsense said about them than the Saint.

Will you break the mould and attempt to justify those nonsensical statements with some facts, or hide under your cowardly anonymity?

Andrew Keenan
Former Editor

PS. To those who think that I should stay out of this argument as AP-Elect: I feel it's necessary to defend any student group who has this much rubbish spoken about them; and also I'm obviously well-acquainted with the actual facts re The Saint - so I feel this post is justified.

[What?]

Quoting akeenan from 16:55, 22nd Apr 2008
The Saint has been nothing but supportive to STAR FM,

Could people take note that it isn't STAR FM any longer, it's just STAR. As it's web-only calling the station FM doesn't work. That's what the DJ handbook says anyway.

I agree with you though, good post.

[exnihilo]

Using in the sense of not paying commercial rent or any of the associated costs of that space, I presume.

[Doc]

[b]Quoting akeenan from 16:55, Using not renting, eh - read the rental contract recently?

Isnt it a comically small amount of money?

[The Black Vegetable]

Pretty much.

Also, they didn't pay several years worth of rent because someone lost the contract. So they had a free office for quite some time.

I do think they should be thrown out, and the space put to better use. We are told that it could run anywhere, well, why not give it a go?

[Guest]

Quoting from 13:58, 21st Apr 2008
When it slandered James Potton in 2006.

I'd love to know what it wrote about Jamie.

The saint was shite. From what I have read here its hard to believe it was any better. Half the readers bought it to see Halo, some bought because they were in it and the rest bought because they wrote articles or letters to it.

[Mr Comedy]

Quoting The Black Vegetable from 21:50, 22nd Apr 2008
Pretty much.

Also, they didn't pay several years worth of rent because someone lost the contract. So they had a free office for quite some time.

I do think they should be thrown out, and the space put to better use. We are told that it could run anywhere, well, why not give it a go?

Having said that, when they did lose the office we were told that they couldn't publish anything, so I'd doubt it could run anywhere.

[hr]

"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung

[Jamie potton]

Quoting from 23:09, 22nd Apr 2008

Quoting from 13:58, 21st Apr 2008
When it slandered James Potton in 2006.

I'd love to know what it wrote about Jamie.

The saint was shite. From what I have read here its hard to believe it was any better. Half the readers bought it to see Halo, some bought because they were in it and the rest bought because they wrote articles or letters to it.

http://www.pcc.org.uk/news/index.html?article=MzkxNg==

"COMPLAINANT NAME:
Mr Jamie Potton

CLAUSES NOTED: 1

PUBLICATION: The Saint

COMPLAINT:
Mr Jamie Potton of St Andrews complained that an article suggested he had stolen a bottle of whiskey; that a debate had been stopped so that the bottle could be retrieved and; that his behaviour more generally was inappropriate.

RESOLUTION:
The matter was resolved when the newspaper published a retraction of the inaccuracies in the article and a letter from the complainant."


Thanks for asking, unregistered friend! I had almost forgotten that. The Saint was rather ghastly and ill-researched, and it was not just I who was affected; which is why its very existence was threatened, and why it still has such a stigma.
Still, at least now it's free, so I don't have to pick one up from the floor. Like many things, I prefer not to pay for it.
It is, however, the only journalistic endeavour which survives from year-to-year, which does not bode well for the Robe.

[exnihilo]

Had they bothered to ask, they would have discovered that both bottles in the Chamber were in fact whiskEy, being Jamesons, and that they were not the property of the Debating Society, but had been bought by the acting speaker for the debate, me, and that I had freely given the bottle to Mr Potton.

[Tweedle-Dum]

Why would they talk to any of the people the story was about?

Ludicrous!

[hr]

Tetragrammaton is a four letter word.

[greg-o]

Quoting akeenan from 16:55, 22nd Apr 2008
The Chihuahua essentially committed suicide with a particularly controversial issue, and funding was withdrawn.

For those of us not in the know, what is the story behind The Chihuahua closing down? I sent it an article about possible honorary degree recipients and next thing it’s closed. I would really have liked to have written for it, what happened?

[Garnet]

wasn't something to do with the Christian Union and a joke the paper made?

[hr]

so alive, so full of fire and music!

[The Truth]

Quoting greg-o from 17:14, 23rd Apr 2008

Quoting akeenan from 16:55, 22nd Apr 2008
The Chihuahua essentially committed suicide with a particularly controversial issue, and funding was withdrawn.

For those of us not in the know, what is the story behind The Chihuahua closing down? I sent it an article about possible honorary degree recipients and next thing it’s closed. I would really have liked to have written for it, what happened?

While it's a bit of a taboo topic with the university and is largely to never be spoken of again, you may be able to find the The Saint article on the subject. This explains its demise with a degree of relish only matched by the degree of poor research and spurious accusation.

Furthermore, suicide is such an ignominious term for it. "Going out in a blaze of glory" is perhaps better.

[thePontificator]

I think it would be fair to say the Chihuahua was 'put down' rather than 'committed suicide.'

Anyway, good luck to the Robe but saying that you're independent and free of charge isn't much good if you haven't got any content. Say what you like about the Saint, at least it's got some quite long words in it.

[Guest]

Come on, now you have to tell us. The Saint webpage doesn't get updated so we'll never know