Assessed Presentations

[Estuderino]

Hi all, I was just wondering how other people feel about assessed presentations in arts modules (or sciences I suppose). Personally, I hate them, but I don't know whether or not I'm alone in feeling this way. I understand it's important to develop speaking skills, but I don't think a 15 minute assessed presentation in each module is the way to go about that. Firstly, it means that everyone else in that module will have to sit through a couple (if not several) of these presentations in each seminar, which eats into time that could be better spent having actual discussions led by professors and people who are actually experts in the subject (instead of, as it sometimes goes, someone who stayed up all night drafting a presentation from Wikipedia pages). This becomes especially annoying when seminars are filled to the brim with more students than there should be in a class. When you're only getting 4 hours of class time each week, that time becomes pretty valuable! In my personal experience tutors rarely correct errors in people's presentations so as not to embarrass them in front of the class, which means that people who diligently took notes during that presentation may end up going into the exam with incorrect information.

As far as assessment goes, it annoys me that presentations are marked by fellow students who (more likely than not) showed up to the tutorial not having read anything about the topic at hand, and therefore can't really tell how well the student presentation covered the assigned material. I know that when I personally fill out peer assessment forms, the numbers I put down are often arbitrary and in truth I have no idea whether the person made all the right points. I also tend to give generally the same mark to everyone, and it seems everyone else does too. Over the past two years, I have received the same mark on every presentation I have given (give or take .3 on the 20 point scale), despite the fact that I put different amounts of work into each one, and presented each one in a different style. No matter how hard I try to improve my presentations, I always end up with the same mark!

The reason for all this whining is that I was wondering if anyone else shares this view, or if most people like the system in place and disagree with me.

[the Empress]

having a presentation assessed solely by your peers sucks because they're very hard markers - at least in my degree, we were told that we marked way harder than the lecturer. Saying that, I enjoy giving presentations as I love being asked about stuff I've spent ages working on . . . finally, a captive audience! Certainly I've sat through a number of mind-numbing presentations (mortifyingly I fell asleep during a whole bunch of presentations during honours, but in my defence that was during dissertation hell), but occasionally you get some really interesting ones. I listened to a presentation on sustainable toilet paper once - it was brilliant . . . .

Maybe try not to concentrate too much on the mark, but on the feedback you get during the session? After giving one presentation a girl told me it was the best she'd heard and it was such a buzz. You can tell when you've engaged your audience. It also helps me learn things, because if I'm not fully prepared I get incredibly and embaressingly nervous (walking into chairs, stuttering etc.) Giving presentations at uni from 1st to 5th year aided that development though. Plus y'know you get to benchmark. If you listen to someone and think 'this is such crap' it probably is (aargh, people who don't weight their numbers appropriately are annoying). If you are upset with your grades, I'd recommend asking the lecturer to think about weight the mark 50% peer and 50% lecturer. But generally, a really great presentation will stand out.

[lizzie_liz]

in Biology we have been giving presentations ever since 1st year (I am now 4th year) and to be honest I think they are very useful. We use presentations to discuss a particular topic and have to use research papers, wikipedia is not used.

In my 4th year I had one module last semester whereby everyone had to give 1 presentation a semester and you choose the topic from a list. the module co-ordinators marked our presentations and classmates had to summarize everyones presentation which counted towards our assessment. All presentations were powerpoint and informative.

This semester again I have a module which requires weekly presentations, but these are not assessed and everyone has to present a paper so yet again no wikipedia and although the non assessments appears pointless, we then use the presentations to write essays on the topics.

Biology research dissertations also require a presentation to go alongside the written part of the disseration, this allows you to correct or go into further detail your research topic.

yes it is true that students are harsher markers but in Biology ours are also marked by the lecturer and the marks are combined.

Overall I think presentations do serve a purpose and very useful

[Power Metal Dom]

I'd have agreed with the OP fully last semester or earlier this year. 'Thank fuck!' I thought when my appendicitis meant I couldn't give an assessed presentation in front of everyone and two tutors who would pounce with questions. 'Oh fuck!' I thought when it turns out one of my modules this semester would include two seminar presentations. I'm no public speaker, despite my constant gabbing, and the thought of speaking authoritatively in front of an audience of my peers and a professor is nerve-racking. Turns out they're not only a very helpful method of learning but also a big ego/confidence boost

[Estuderino]

The thing is, I have no problem giving presentations. I've never had any fears about speaking in public. I just want to be able to raise my mark! I also don't want to listen to countless long presentations that are impossible to follow because the person speaking is nervous - and then have to teach myself half the topics in the module for the exam because the teaching was done by a student and not a professional teacher! I prefer modules where frequent short, non-assessed presentations are required. Helps with public speaking, inspires discussions, encourages independent preparation for seminars, but doesn't bring down my overall mark. I guess I'm alone then. The purpose of this was less to rant than to see what other people's opinions on this were, but now that I've started whining about this I can't stop.

[Edinburgh Boy]

With any luck, the lecturer/tutor will disregard the peer assessment component and simply apply their own mark. I do know that this has happened in the past, and it seems entirely sensible.

[the Empress]

Do you get no feedback at all from the lecturer? If not, email/corner them to get some feedback which should help you out. Don't you have any lectures or discussions? I'm confused - your module teaching time consists solely of student presentations? If it's any consolation I was always annoyed at group presentations where you're given a group mark.


[quote="Estuderino"]The thing is, I have no problem giving presentations. I've never had any fears about speaking in public. I just want to be able to raise my mark! I also don't want to listen to countless long presentations that are impossible to follow because the person speaking is nervous - and then have to teach myself half the topics in the module for the exam because the teaching was done by a student and not a professional teacher! I prefer modules where frequent short, non-assessed presentations are required. [quote]

[Jono]

The thing is, I have no problem giving presentations. I've never had any fears about speaking in public. I just want to be able to raise my mark! I also don't want to listen to countless long presentations that are impossible to follow because the person speaking is nervous - and then have to teach myself half the topics in the module for the exam because the teaching was done by a student and not a professional teacher! I prefer modules where frequent short, non-assessed presentations are required. Helps with public speaking, inspires discussions, encourages independent preparation for seminars, but doesn't bring down my overall mark. I guess I'm alone then. The purpose of this was less to rant than to see what other people's opinions on this were, but now that I've started whining about this I can't stop.

From the sound of it, you were in my 3000 level class this week. Although I doubt my experience of assessed presentations is unique.

As for presentations, I'm ambiguous. On the one hand, I shouldn't criticise the system because I tend to get marked quite highly in them. But I agree that they can be a problem for time. Ideally, a speaker should be marked down for going over time or if their presentation is incoherent. On the other hand, I know of people who get great marks in presentations which are more style than substance simply because they happen to be halfway-decent public speakers (I am aware of the hypocrisy!). As for the peer-assessment, I agree that it isn't necessarily the best method. I know some students who give all 15's to everyone, regardless of the presentation. I know others who mark very harshly. Still, In the case of History, the mark derived is usually 50% Aggregate PA, and 50% Tutor's mark, so marks aren't totally at the mercy of your feral classmates!

As for having to teach yourself half the material, that's kind of the whole point. A Seminar or Tutorial is not for the Students to sit there like nodding donkeys while the academic goes over everything for you. Similarly, just because someone else is assigned a presentation topic, it doesn't give everyone else in the class an excuse to skive off and not prepare for that part of the seminar. Arts teaching revolves around self-study, with the Tutorial, and to a lesser extent the Seminar, acting as a student-led discussion group. The Presentation, assessed or not, should set the stage for discussion for the class; not be an end in itself.

[Estuderino]

I don't think I'm in the same module as you because this past week was relatively free of presentations for me, but I'm (selfishly) glad someone else knows what I'm talking about.

You're right about having to prepare for seminars as they are not supposed to be lectures. But what I'm talking about is when people say things that are completely wrong and no one calls them out on it. In general class discussion, errors can be un-awkwardly addressed, but not in presentations. If the tutor interrupts to point out the error, it may embarrass the person or cause everyone to mark them down too much. So the errors go uncorrected, possibly finding their way into people's exam papers.

As for the other person who replied, no, my classes are not taught entirely through student presentations, or at least that's not the way it's supposed to be. On paper, I spend 4 hours per week being taught (or participating in discussions led by) by a qualified expert. But in practice, because there are too many people in my seminars, I spend 2 hours (in a good week) being taught by said experts, and 2+ listening to presentations.