Formal Dress Forum

[Eliot Wilson]

I think we're using trews in its modern rather than strict sense.

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Bill and Ted beat the Grim Reaper at Twister

Bill: "You played very well, Death, especially with your totally heavy Death robes."

Death: "Don't patronise me."

[RJ Covino]

Quoting Eliot Wilson from 18:23, 20th Apr 2008
I think we're using trews in its modern rather than strict sense.

Stricto sensu even, to borrow a phrase.

[Jamie potton]

[quote]Quoting Dickie from 15:12, 20th Apr 2008


(this is not ment to offend anyone not even the late Dr C....)

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Dead? I didn't know he was ill...

Anyway, like all things, this requires confidence and the rare state of not being a twat to pull off. The tartan waistcoat is an option only for a certain St Andrean MSP.

[Jamie potton]

[quote]Quoting Dickie from 15:12, 20th Apr 2008


(this is not ment to offend anyone not even the late Dr C....)

[hr]

Dead? I didn't know he was ill...

Anyway, like all things, this requires confidence and the rare state of not being a twat to pull off. The tartan waistcoat is an option only for a certain St Andrean MSP.

[RJ Covino]

Quoting Jamie Potton from 01:55, 22nd Apr 2008

Dead? I didn't know he was ill...

Anyway, like all things, this requires confidence and the rare state of not being a twat to pull off. The tartan waistcoat is an option only for a certain St Andrean MSP.

Not dead. I can hear the 'shame' from Chattanooga.

And I believe the garment in question is irrelevant to the present discussion, being some manner of tartan catsuit...

[Steveo]

I have a couple of gown questions, having recently forked out £222 to Ede and Ravenscroft for the Russell Cord.

Firstly, can I wear it as a graduand (not that there will be any functions to wear it to in that time)? Secondly, on that, when exactly does one become a graduand? Is it after the last exam or when you receive your degree classification?

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Get off my internet.

[fearghas]

I was under one became a graduand as soon as the last exam was done; so that the only option left for you was to graduate. You have done everything required to be a graduate, bar graduating.

As for the gowns, I don't know. Is it really permissible to wear said gown without the hood, as you would have to? (Apart, of course, for the period of the actual graduation)

I await the response from more learned chaps than myself.

[Al]

As said above, you're a graduand the moment you finish your last exam.

I don't think that there's anything wrong in wearing a graduate gown without a hood. After all, the gown indicates the wearer is a graduate, and the hood shows the type of degree. That said, until you graduate you're not a graduate. I'd suggest that you shouldn't wear the gown until then.

[Jason Dunn]

Quoting fearghas from 14:44, 15th May 2008
I was under one became a graduand as soon as the last exam was done; so that the only option left for you was to graduate. You have done everything required to be a graduate, bar graduating.

I thought that one became a graduand when the the degree classification was revealed; the rationale being that sitting the exam. is not the same as having satisfactorily done everything required to graduate: one could, for instance, fail the examination, debarring one from graduating.

Still, I expect Al knows his onions.

[Al]

Quoting Jason Dunn from 23:03, 15th May 2008
I thought that one became a graduand when the the degree classification was revealed; the rationale being that sitting the exam. is not the same as having satisfactorily done everything required to graduate: one could, for instance, fail the examination, debarring one from graduating.

Actually, that's a good point. I've only heard the "after the last exam" definition for when one becomes a graduand. Perhaps the rationale is that if one is in honours then - at the very least - a general degree is guaranteed.

[Dickie]

Quoting Steveo from 14:00, 15th May 2008
Firstly, can I wear it as a graduand?

NO.

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[Anon.]

Quoting Dickie from 17:50, 16th May 2008

Quoting Steveo from 14:00, 15th May 2008
Firstly, can I wear it as a graduand?

NO.

Surely he can? After all, graduands legitimately wear the gown when they attend their graduation but before they've actually graduated - they don't carry it and then put it on after graduating, like the hood. It would therefore seem to follow that graduands wear the gown only, while graduates wear the hood and gown.

[exnihilo]

I suspect the wearing of the gown to the ceremony pre-graduation is rather more to do with practicality than right. One is not a graduate until one has graduated, one should not, therefore, wear a graduate gown until then. For an hour or two immediately before, while in the hall waiting to, really doesn't count.

Also, graduand is from the announcement of degree class.

[Steveo]

Quoting exnihilo from 00:59, 19th May 2008
Also, graduand is from the announcement of degree class.

Yes, that's what I suspected, but couldn't get a clear answer.

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Get off my internet.

[Mr Comedy]

Agreed - when you are awarded with a degree you can wear it. As you have not yet been awarded one you cannot yet wear it. And given my knowledge of your academic diligence, getting a degree is very much a case of 'if' not 'when'.

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"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung

[ChrisH]

The main organisation carrying out events before graduation is the chapel choir. And whilst certainly not an authoritative source on university clothing regulations it is certainly the practice that students graduating that year continue to wear either the red or St Mary's gowns until the day of their graduation, when they appear sans hoods in their graduate gowns.

Plus it would probably hex your degree if you were to wear the graduate gown for anything other than a photo, and maybe even that, before getting the classification.

[Lid]

Quoting Mr Comedy from 19:58, 19th May 2008
when you are awarded with a degree you can wear it.

Does that mean it's fine as soon as your record card shows a classification? That seems at odds with what some some say - or is there a subtle distinction between 'recommended for...' and having been awarded? If so, does that not entrust an awful amount of power in Dr Lang to say otherwise?

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Mathematical Anti Telharsic Harfatum Septomin

[exnihilo]

You can wear it when you graduate, not when you are told your clasification. When you know your classification you become a graduand, when the Chancellor (or his duly appointed deputy) graduates you, you become a graduate and have the right to that gown. Even if you graduate in absentia your name will be read out in the ceremony and that is the moment at which you graduate. By convention, you wear the black gown in the hall for the ceremony, but that should really be the first official use - by all means get pictures done in advance, but you're not a graduate until you graduate. It's simple, really.

[Anon.]

This subject reminded me that there was formerly a whole separate place for discussing academic dress - I just checked and it's still there, in the long-neglected Gowns section of the Sinner's Guide to St Andrews.

[Mr Comedy]

Bring it back I say - there isn't enough conversation about academic dress in my opinion.

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"I am in no way interested in immortality, but only in the taste of tea. " -Lu Tung