Maiden Speaker's Travesty?

[Prophet Tenebrae]

While I greatly enjoyed the Speaker's Dinner and subsequent hilarity (though the lack of proper after party pained me) I found in conversations with at least a dozen people - and as obviously reflected by the voting of the house... that the proposition was sorely lacking.

I won't mince words but while I was pretty much undecided when I walked in the distinct lack of merit on the proposition and the great skill of the first two opposition speakers entirely made me vote against the motion.

So, really I have to ask not only if I am the only person who feels that there was some great injustice done to the opposition but also just what the judges were thinking.

[Mr Comedy]

I found a party...

[little headache]

I probably shouldn't even meddle, but as my friend is the girl who won last night, I thought I would put in my two cents. In my opinion, the only reason that the proposition was lacking was because there were barely any new ideas introduced other than what Ms. Rhodes brought up. Though I am clearly biased, I thought hers was the only truly original argument of the night, and was not only rational, but extremely convincing and well prepared, in light of the very difficult motion that was proposed. I think we should give her an enormous amount of credit.

The second place winner, however, I am in no position to comment on.

[hr]...the truth is rarely pure and never simple; modern life would be very tedious if it were either, and modern literature a complete impossibility...

[Stuart]

Not that I'll know anyone, but what were the results?

[RJ Covino]

[s]Stuart wrote on 12:20, 21st Oct 2004:
Not that I'll know anyone, but what were the results?


Well, one result was that I learned a lot. For example, "the gays" as they were consistently referred to throughout the debate, have a single agenda...

To answer the original poster's query about why the proposition won the prizes and not the debate, the answer most likely lies in the fact that they put together a better technical case and were better participants in the parliamentary style of debate overall.

That said, I found the proposition's case to be bordering, at times, on the offensive. Did this influence how I voted? Sure. Did it stop me from respecting their abilities as speakers? Absolutely not. As the Association President will attest, I predicted with the very highest degree of accuracy (100%, in fact) the outcome of the prizes well before the judges decamped. They were just that good.

Congratulations to all involved. It was a rather excellent night.

Congratulations, also, to the President and Convenor of the University of St Andrews Union Debating Society on his victory in the post-pier walk Cloister Race. Peter Blair thus replaces me as the fleetest of foot within the society.

[Eliot Wilson]

Who comprised the judging panel, incidentally?

[hr]Bill and Ted beat the Grim Reaper at Twister

Bill: "You played very well, Death, especially with your totally heavy Death robes."

Death: "Don't patronise me."

[Mr Comedy]

John Stewart, Jason Vit, Kizzy, Ewan MacDonald and Lindsay Mucka.

I would also like to enquire - who has my dinner jacket?
It wasn't left in the cathedral, as I went and checked.

[Tweedle-Dum]

[s]Mr Comedy wrote on 13:02, 21st Oct 2004:
John Stewart, Jason Vit, Kizzy, Ewan MacDonald and Lindsay Mucka.

I would also like to enquire - who has my dinner jacket?
It wasn't left in the cathedral, as I went and checked.


With the staff? What did they say?

[hr]
Live by the sword, die by the arrow.

[Tweedle-Dum]

Also, Mr Vit, If you are to lead singing, at least

a). Learn the songs
b). Learn more of them
or
c). Invite other speakers to lead songs
d). Invite along Alasdair Pew


[hr]
Live by the sword, die by the arrow.

[Mr Comedy]

[s]Tweedle-Dum wrote on 13:57, 21st Oct 2004:
With the staff? What did they say?


No, I broke back in that evening and looked on the bench for it, so someone knows where it is.
Again, please can someone tell me?

[Eliot Wilson]

[s]Tweedle-Dum wrote on 14:00, 21st Oct 2004:
d). Invite along Alasdair Pew


Alistair Pugh, I think you'll find.

[hr]
Bill and Ted beat the Grim Reaper at Twister

Bill: "You played very well, Death, especially with your totally heavy Death robes."

Death: "Don't patronise me."

[S.L.G.]

We have it. I picked it up so that nobody else would pinch it. . .you may have it back whenever you would like

[Tweedle-Dum]

[s]S.L.G. wrote on 15:02, 21st Oct 2004:
We have it. I picked it up so that nobody else would pinch it. . .you may have it back whenever you would like




That's good, Ralph said I took it from the Union, and spent a considerable amount of time searching my room.

[Mr Comedy]

[s]S.L.G. wrote on 15:02, 21st Oct 2004:
We have it. I picked it up so that nobody else would pinch it. . .you may have it back whenever you would like



My hero!
I'll email you about a suitable time to come and pick it up.

[John Stewart]

There is no way I can explain the intricacies of judging philosophy in a single post, nor shall I attempt it. Those who have attended the judging training sessions and/or have experience of judging competitive debates should know that winning over the audience and winning the debate technically are two very, VERY different tasks. The audience have the luxury of voting for the side that makes points that sit nicely with their beliefs. The judges however must lay their personal beliefs and misgivings to the side and mark on the technical merits of speeches in both content and style. Whether or not we agree with what the speakers said is not an issue - we can only judge on areas where their opposing colleagues took disagreement.

Suffice to say the adjudication was not easy, but it was clear. The standard of debate was exceptional, particularly in light of it being a Maidens final. I only hope that the finalists go on to gain more experience and fulfill their obvious potential.

Oh, and while I remember, the winners were:

1st Place: Miss Elizabeth Rhodes
2nd Place: Mr K. Douglas Cochrane

Congratulations.

[Bryn]

I personally thought Ms Rhodes' speech was excellent, and well worthy of winning the prize. I also happened to agree with most of it, although "gay" is an adjective, not a noun.

[hr]http://bryn.ipfox.com

[exnihilo]

Surely, it is whatever part of speech it is employed as? Such is the wonder of the English language.

After all, "I am the only gay in the village".

[Tweedle-Dum]

[s]exnihilo wrote on 01:08, 22nd Oct 2004:
Surely, it is whatever part of speech it is employed as? Such is the wonder of the English language.

After all, "I am the only gay in the village".


I do believe still that gay is an adjective. Words like faggot or poofter are perfectly good nouns to use before resorting to further bastardisation of our fine language.

[hr]
Live by the sword, die by the arrow.

[Alex Jennings]

I thoroughly enjoyed this year's Maidens Competition, perhaps because I didn't have to compete and especially because none of the speakers directed harrassing comments my way.

If only my ankle hadn't gave way...ow ow ow. Co-dydramol is my friend.

[exnihilo]

[s]Tweedle-Dum wrote on 12:33, 22nd Oct 2004:Words like faggot or poofter are perfectly good nouns to use before resorting to further bastardisation of our fine language.


It's not bastardisation, dear. They call it adapting, depveloping if you will, nay evolving!