Formal Dress Forum

[exnihilo]

Incidentally, at 2,000 posts (2,001 now) this is the second longest thread on the sinner. And, as far as I can make out the longest continually running thread, as the longest one (A Thread By Any Other Name, 4,995 posts) was started almost a month later).

Give yourselves a pat on the back.

[Cain]

Quoting exnihilo from 15:34, 16th Oct 2005
Give yourselves a pat on the back.

Though the ATBAON thread does stay on topic for all of its posts where this one meanders around every which way.

[hr]

I hold an element of surprise

[Stuart]

Congratulations Gentlemen, particularly to Mr Wilson who has posted 311 times, Mr Joss (247), and Mr Renouf (181).

[Al]

Quoting Cain from 15:59, 16th Oct 2005
Though the ATBAON thread does stay on topic for all of its posts where this one meanders around every which way.

I was unaware that there *was* a topic for the ATBAON thread.

[Cain]

has missed the point of the game

[hr]

I hold an element of surprise

[Donald Renouf]

Quoting Stuart from 16:02, 16th Oct 2005
Congratulations Gentlemen, particularly to Mr Wilson who has posted 311 times, Mr Joss (247), and Mr Renouf (181).

So Mr Wilson was pretty accurate in his prediction that

Quoting Eliot Wilson from 16:37, 13th Nov 2003
...it does just turn out to be Messrs. Joss, Renouf and Blair, and m'good self [who] air views on the thorny subject of What To Wear.

Mr Blair letting the side down, though.

[Anon.]

I beg his pardon, Dr Wilson. Though were I (ridiculously remote hypothesis) ever to become a Doctor, I'd still call myself Mr.

[Tweedle-Dum]

Quoting Donald Renouf from 19:55, 16th Oct 2005

Quoting Stuart from 16:02, 16th Oct 2005
Congratulations Gentlemen, particularly to Mr Wilson who has posted 311 times, Mr Joss (247), and Mr Renouf (181).

So Mr Wilson was pretty accurate in his prediction that

Quoting Eliot Wilson from 16:37, 13th Nov 2003
...it does just turn out to be Messrs. Joss, Renouf and Blair, and m'good self [who] air views on the thorny subject of What To Wear.

Mr Blair letting the side down, though.

1. Does Mr Blair know how to use a computer?

2. Why does the discussion turn to how long this thread is every time a round number of posts or pages is reached?

[hr]

Live by the sword, die by the arrow.

[Jamie potton]

Yes, well, right...

Anyway, slips quite simply consist of two pieces of white cotton fabric (one for each side of the wastcoat), 10-12 inches long by about two inches across, which are secured internally by means of three or four buttons in the lining. Someone (Anon.?) did ask some time ago...though the vexed marcella/plain fabric question remains for these, as with all good things.

I would be interested to know their purpose: perhaps they represent some kind of under-waistcoat, long lost in the midsts of sartorial time?

[Anon.]

Really? How disappointing. I tend to think clothes should be as "honest" as possible (no made-up ties, no backless waistcoats, working cuff buttons, etc.) and what you have described goes against that whole ethos. Presumably at some earlier, purer time slips (like the strange object that is the modern evening waistcoat) had a more substantial existence. I suppose I'll just have to end up wearing two waistcoats, which would be very hot, but then one must suffer for one's art.

Definitely not marcella, though. I would have thought that cloth was the sole preserve of evening wear (and, I suppose, Court dress).

[BasilSeal]

Others aren't doing too badly on posting, though...

[Guest]

my late grandfather had a sporran top fashioned from the skull of a wild cat

[J.C.H.]

Anyway, slips quite simply consist of two pieces of white cotton fabric (one for each side of the wastcoat), 10-12 inches long by about two inches across, which are secured internally by means of three or four buttons in the lining. Someone (Anon.?) did ask some time ago...though the vexed marcella/plain fabric question remains for these, as with all good things.

I would be interested to know their purpose: perhaps they represent some kind of under-waistcoat, long lost in the midsts of sartorial time?

Slips date from the time when cloth dyes held much less fast than their modern counterparts. Richly dyed materials would often run and lose their colours quickly with the slightest moisture, and so a protective tunic in linen or cotton was worn underneath, acting as a sort of blotting pad, protecting the wearer and the clothing beneath from picking up the dye (remember too that many dyes were made from what we would regard to-day as somewhat hazardous chemicals, so slips were also regarded as a necessary health precaution!)

Nowadays, improvements in dyeing techniques render the garment quite unecessary, but the vestiges remain in the form of a band worn around the collar and fastened to the behind the waistcoat leaving the outer edge exposed: The Prince of Wales can be seen wearing one in his most recent wedding photographs.

I've never known them to be made in diaper materials like marcella since they aren't really meant to be seen - they are usually made in bleached cotton or linen.

[deacon brodie]

Quoting Anon. from 20:09, 17th Oct 2005


Definitely not marcella, though. I would have thought that cloth was the sole preserve of evening wear (and, I suppose, Court dress).

Court dress most certainly - no "I suppose" about it.

[BasilSeal]

Chaps,

As an academic philosopher I get to write on topics that are very interesting to me, but of limited interest to most of the population! (With the possible exception of my recent book, *Stakes and Kidneys*, arguing for markets for human organs!) However, to lighten things up a bit I've written a paper on the ethics of wearing clothing items, such as regimental ties, that might give the impression that the wearer has certain institutional affiliations.

I have to admit that even though it's rather tongue-in-cheek this paper can be a bit dense at times (it is, after all, written for an academic journal, and we must respect the proprieties!) but if anyone would like a copy for amusement please email me at jstaylor90 AT msn dot com

[BasilSeal]

Maddocks and Dick have just informed me that they'll do a small run of 36 United College ties. I've yet to find out the price, but it certainly won't be for more than the price Loot was charging. Would anyone be interested in such a tie? If so, let me know! (Email in previous post.)

[BasilSeal]

Also, does anyone have a scan of a UC tie? I don't, and M&D have said one would be useful for them to identify it. Apparently they do a lot of ties for St Andrews!

[Tweedle-Dum]

Quoting BasilSeal from 14:24, 20th Oct 2005
Maddocks and Dick have just informed me that they'll do a small run of 36 United College ties. I've yet to find out the price, but it certainly won't be for more than the price Loot was charging. Would anyone be interested in such a tie? If so, let me know! (Email in previous post.)

Bow Ties would be nice too

[hr]

Live by the sword, die by the arrow.

[Ian McFarlane]

Should servants and waiters wear a different style of dinner jacket from diners? Or, is there one style of dinner jacket which servants and waiters should only wear? A friends once implied that this was the case.

[Jason Dunn]

Quoting Ian McFarlane from 00:09, 31st Oct 2005
Should servants and waiters wear a different style of dinner jacket from diners? Or, is there one style of dinner jacket which servants and waiters should only wear? A friends once implied that this was the case.

I believe their buttons are usually metal, as with doormen and the like. Whether this is a rule or not, I don't know.

Also, I think servants wear black ties with their metal buttoned tailcoats.