The Americans

[Sabina]

I want to know if the rest of us are going to step up and help the Americans with all the devistation in their southern states. Have you guys seen these pictures? As much aid as they give the rest of the world for relief, isn't it time the rest of the world started to help THEM?

[Gealle]

Bollocks.

What they 'pledge' and what they do are slightly different.

I've yet to see Americans help out where they can't profit in some way.

Horrible tragedy, yes. But let them deal with it themselves. I can't see them helping out if this had happened in, say... the north of England... Where there have been some pretty dreadful flash floods overnight, and which the BBC seems to have ignored.

[bramble]

It is awful, you're right and i feel dreadfully sorry for all the people personally involved in the tragedy, but really the USA can sort out the problems itself. They should only recieve aid when they lack the necessary amounts of rescue equipment etc,they should not recieve aid in monetary form. The USA has plenty of disposable money that it can put towards the relief effort - especially as its a country that spends so much on its military.
The major natural disasters of the last few years have all happened in third world countries that obviously require a lot more aid to cope than the USA, and therefore aid was given by other countries where it was desperately needed. Aid should not be given on a 'we helped you so now you must help us' basis, aid should only be given when a country genuinely cannot cope with the scale of its problem.
If the USA does need say extra rescue helicopters, then by all means countries like the UK should help them out there, after all we do have the means and we have been helped out in the past.
Im not usually a person given to this kind of ranting, but ive thought about this issue a lot and i think the above are reasonable ways of working it out without the USA money grabbing and without the rest of the world completely ignoring the tragedy.

[hr]

And i still hold your hand in mine when im asleep

[Haunted]

I'm not sure sending some of our rescue copters would be a good idea

[s]http://today.reuters.com/investing/financeArticle.aspx?type=bondsNews&storyID=URI:urn:newsml:reuters.com:20050901:MTFH33836_2005-09-01_11-50-09_N01434130:1[/s]

Makes you wonder

edited for linkage problems

[Haunted]

I'm not so sure sending some of our helicopters would be a good idea

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4205074.stm

Makes you wonder

[DrAlex]

Quoting bramble from 15:39, 1st Sep 2005
If the USA does need say extra rescue helicopters, then by all means countries like the UK should help them out

I don't think the UK has any commitments for the US right now. Speaking as a yank I wouldn't want the aid, and speaking as a person raised my whole life in London, I don't think we should give it. The US has the means to deal with this disaster-anyone remember L.A. 1990? And if they need help (for instance, extra birds as you said) Canada would be the logical first choice.

[hr]

RUSH KATO '05!

rush.kato@gmail.com

[novium]

Bramble- the problem is as always, time. After the 1906 earthquake, San Francisco was rebuilt in three years. But what about the period of time between the disaster and rebuilding? The government was doing what it could, people were doing what they could, but it was hard to get things moving FAST enough. And for this sort of thing, at least you could say it would be put to immediate good use instead of lining the pocket of some corrupt dictator while the people starve.

Quoting bramble from 15:39, 1st Sep 2005
It is awful, you're right and i feel dreadfully sorry for all the people personally involved in the tragedy, but really the USA can sort out the problems itself. They should only recieve aid when they lack the necessary amounts of rescue equipment etc,they should not recieve aid in monetary form. The USA has plenty of disposable money that it can put towards the relief effort - especially as its a country that spends so much on its military.
The major natural disasters of the last few years have all happened in third world countries that obviously require a lot more aid to cope than the USA, and therefore aid was given by other countries where it was desperately needed. Aid should not be given on a 'we helped you so now you must help us' basis, aid should only be given when a country genuinely cannot cope with the scale of its problem.
If the USA does need say extra rescue helicopters, then by all means countries like the UK should help them out there, after all we do have the means and we have been helped out in the past.
Im not usually a person given to this kind of ranting, but ive thought about this issue a lot and i think the above are reasonable ways of working it out without the USA money grabbing and without the rest of the world completely ignoring the tragedy.

[hr]

And i still hold your hand in mine when im asleep

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I have no witty signature.

[alias]

Quoting gealle from 14:48, 1st Sep 2005
Bollocks.

What they 'pledge' and what they do are slightly different.

I've yet to see Americans help out where they can't profit in some way.

Horrible tragedy, yes. But let them deal with it themselves. I can't see them helping out if this had happened in, say... the north of England... Where there have been some pretty dreadful flash floods overnight, and which the BBC seems to have ignored.

You are fuking ridiculous. The devastation that has occurred in the gulf states is like night and day as compared to what happened in the countries in S.E. Asia. Thank God the fact that this natural disaster was predicted - most people were able to seek adequate shelter. Seriously, the Tsunamis knocked over wooden huts and some of the buildings with in a few blocks of the coast line; the entire city of New Orleans is destroyed and still flooded with 10-15 ft. of water. The diseases and subsequent illness that are going to spread in this toxic flood are going to be the same ones that plague most 3rd world countries.

But you know what you’re right - America does not NEED your help, we will, as with everything bad that has happened to our country, take care of it ourselves. How soon we forget little things like World War I & II, $950 billion dollars that our country recently pledged to give to Tsunami victims or the billions of dollars we give away in developmental aid each and every year. It would be nice, however, if the rest of the world (and pricks like yourself) would stop thinking within territorial boundaries and look at the big picture: There are a shit load of people who’s lives have just been washed away, help out if you can – America would.

[hr]

All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie.

[DrAlex]

Fair points, but I'm not sure where all this hostility came from. You mention the Gulf and South East Asia in rebutal to what exactly?

Also, how does the header "Damn Right!" fit in with anything you had to say?

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RUSH KATO '05!

rush.kato@gmail.com

[exnihilo]

Quoting alias from 19:55, 1st Sep 2005But you know what you’re right - America does not NEED your help, we will, as with everything bad that has happened to our country, take care of it ourselves. How soon we forget little things like World War I & II, $950 billion dollars that our country recently pledged to give to Tsunami victims or the billions of dollars we give away in developmental aid each and every year.

First, grow the hell up. The world wars were NOT, let me say that again, were NOT won for us by the US in some altruistic effort. Stop saying it, becuase repitition does not make it so.

Second, $950 billion? Are you on drugs???????

[Haunted]

Don't blame them, they all get fed from the propaganda machine

[DrAlex]

The last I heard, Bush had pledged the same (or less than the) amount that the British public had donated.

[hr]

RUSH KATO '05!

rush.kato@gmail.com

[Gealle]

And from experience, the pledge will never be met if the American government is anything to go by.

If you're going to get nasty toward me, could you provide some actual facts to back yourself up?

Cheers.

[Gealle]

Then again, I note that on another thread, Alias is trying to pin the blame for this on the French. Let's not expect any sane facts to counter me any time soon from that direction...

[Gealle]

Hmmmm... So, Alias, you're countering me with fictitious 'facts' and on another thread suggest that the French are to blame...

Someone been on the wacky baccy?

[Humphrey]

Wow, Its amazing what events people will exploit to indulge in a bit of purile America-bashing.

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http://www.livejournal.com/users/humphrey_clarke/

[alias]

I was comparing SE Asia and SE US because of this statement:
The major natural disasters of the last few years have all happened in third world countries that obviously require a lot more aid to cope than the USA, and therefore aid was given by other countries where it was desperately needed. Aid should not be given on a 'we helped you so now you must help us' basis, aid should only be given when a country genuinely cannot cope with the scale of its problem.

No one is asked for a “you scratch my back and I’ll scratch your back” situation, the fact is that there are a lot of people there that lost everything, 10% of the US refining capacity is down, countless oil rigs are out of operation; in both cases the natural disasters are a major blow to their respective counties, how about stopping all of the nation based bull shit and, I don’t know, lend a helping fucking hand if you can.

The header is not meant to mean anything, don't look too much into it, please. If anything I was being facetious.
-
To some other points.
The British and French etc. would have lost WW1&2 if the US did not get involved in some way.

950 billion was a typo, my sincerest apologies – it should be 950 million, yes I’m on drugs.

I don't buy into the propaganda machine, do you?

Bush has not given any number as far as the amount of federal aid that will be provided, it is obviously too early to tell.
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“And from experience, the pledge will never be met if the American government is anything to go by.

If you're going to get nasty toward me, could you provide some actual facts to back yourself up?

Cheers.”
This doesn't make any sense I’m guessing that you are referring to Rush’s comment above which is incorrect in itself. The US has pledged about 350million dollars more to tsunami relief than the entire EU combined; it is now coming out that rebuilding what was lost will not require all of the funds that have been given by all nations so the US will probably not give money away that is not needed – regardless pat on the back to everyone who helped raise money, this is not a competition remember. I'm not getting nasty towards you, only at what you wrote. How about you back your initial statement up with some facts. Cheers.
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The thing about the French was a joke, they founded the city on a swamp and Andrew Jackson captured (dare I say liberated...I'm kidding calm down) from the French.


[hr]

All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie.

[Humphrey]

Quoting gealle from 14:48, 1st Sep 2005
Where there have been some pretty dreadful flash floods overnight, and which the BBC seems to have ignored.

What flash floods??, why can't I find any mention of them on a single news agency and how exactly does the flooding of a few terraced houses 'ooop North' compare to the devastation of an entire city and the deaths of thousands of people?.

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http://www.livejournal.com/users/humphrey_clarke/

[alias]

Just another note, not sure if any of you saw the article in the WSJ yesterday but as far as federal funding for disaster relief goes, in:

1992
The federal government gave $10.8billion in aid for Hurricane Andrew which caused 48.4 Billion dollars of economic damage. Quite a disparity.

1989
The federal government gave $3.1billion in aid for Hurricane Hugo which caused 19.2 Billion dollars of economic damage. Quite a disparity.

My point is this, most of the people who live in this region are already barely getting by, many did not have flood insurance (FEMA is only going to give families up to $25,000), this whole fiasco will probably end up costing around 60-70 billion dollars - money which believe it or not the US doesn't have. If you can find it in your hearts to help a fellow man, please do.


[hr]

All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie.

[novium]

"he State Department said offers so far had come from Belgium, Canada, Russia, Japan, France, Germany, Britain, China, Australia, Jamaica, Honduras, Greece, Venezuela, the Organization of American States,
NATO, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Greece, the Dominican Republic,
El Salvador, Mexico,
South Korea,
Israel and the United Arab Emirates.

Assistance ranged from medical teams, boats, aircraft, tents, blankets, generators and cash donations.

Israeli Prime Minister
Ariel Sharon wrote to Bush offering medical teams that specialized in trauma and natural disasters and said they could be ready in 24 hours.

"During these difficult times, we, the people of Israel stand firmly by your side in a show of solidarity and friendship," said the letter, which was released by the Israeli Embassy in Washington."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20050901/sc_ ... _aid_dc_10

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I have no witty signature.