Another one falls off the cliffs

[Rufus]

Quoting David Bean from 19:11, 3rd Jan 2006

Quoting Rufus from 14:57, 3rd Jan 2006
And dunqn, every death is a tragedy surely?

Not in the Shakespearean sense. If this death was a result of gross carelessness or stupidity, then it may have been (and surely was) pathetic - i.e. inspiring feelings of pity - but as far as sensible people are concerned it can hardly have been tragic, as tragedy requires us to feel empathy for the victim, requiring a sense of 'there but for the grace of God go I'.

Also, I'm not sure I can see the connection between feeling and expressing distaste for a patently absurd and offensive comment, and political correctness; if you think that's what the expression means, you're wrong.

[hr]

I'm your Guardian Angel.

Semantics, dear boy. (But good point).

[hr]

'Love much. Earth has enough bitter in it'
Ella Wheeler Wilcox

[novium]

And, furthermore, like no one else here has pulled any stupid stunts (Hell, I'd bet most of the guys here have done at least something even more stupid), but just were lucky enough to get away with them.

This guy was 20! How about a little sympathy, people, for the guy's friends and family? Imagine if it were your parents getting the news. And so young...

Quoting Rufus from 13:49, 3rd Jan 2006
I'm sorry?

What on earth is your reasoning for being so disrespectful?

There is something wrong with people who laugh at a tragic death, no matter how much the victim may have 'deserved' it for being on the cliff in the first place.

Since when did life become so worthless to you?


Idiots.

[hr]

'Love much. Earth has enough bitter in it'
Ella Wheeler Wilcox

[hr]

quo vobis mentes, rectae quae stare solebant antehac, dementis sese flexere viai?

[Insight]

Surely the general point is that the death of any appparent innocent is a tragedy.

Those such as Hitler & Stalin were great perpetuers of death and are exempt as they were infamous monsters; this poor (though undoubtedly reckless and perhaps stupid) lad was victim of an avoidable accident.

Would the same thread about two young teenage girls killed at a railway crossing (knwoing a train was nearby) have contained the same ridicule & mockery? Bearing in mind the people in questions were British, female, younger (15 I think?) & not in St.Andrews? Had it been a 15 year old London girl who fell, would the same comments have arisen?

It's sad that (regardless of how silly it may seem to some) someone died unnecessarily.


[hr]

SRC Member for Sexualities & Genders

[tylermatts]

I'm sorry, but did no one else read the article and laugh at the existence of the Royal Society for the Prevention of Accidents?

[Paranoid]

I've lost total respect for the administration of this message board if a thread such as this has not been considered for deletion, lesser threads have been removed in the past, albeit the distant past (the Sinner's standards have dropped so badly over the last 4 years). Just because 'its the norm' these days doesn't mean its right

[hr]

..I've got this pain down all the diodes on my left side...

[Eliot Wilson]

Oh, don't be so silly. The initial comments were crass and boorish, but if you don't like, just don't read it. It's a very simple answer.

[hr]

Bill and Ted beat the Grim Reaper at Twister

Bill: "You played very well, Death, especially with your totally heavy Death robes."

Death: "Don't patronise me."

[Grandpa]

Grief or no grief, it is a sad thing when anyone dies. That one knows the deceased or not is irrelevant apart from possibly having a bearing on the extent to which one displays emotion.

To deny the sadness of a tragic event is, I would posit, somewhat inhuman.

Grief, I suppose, could be interpretted in different ways, as regrds it's severity for example. Therefore, to deny that one feels any severity of grief at another's death is also inhuman.

In the end, I also did not know the poor fellow, but my thoughts are with his family and friends, for obvious reasons, and regrdless of whether I know them or not.

Loosing a friend or member of family is generally awfull. Fact.

[hr]

[s]Cogitationis poenam nemo meretur, facias ipse quod faciamus suades - pax vobiscum.[/s]

[maz]

To be honest my first thoughts were a bit along the lines of "silly bugger". It is very sad that a young life has been lost. But from the initial facts I heard, someone in a position to be falling of the cliffs at 2am has probably been drinking, it's not like the cliffs are somewhere you are likely to be at 2am. What was he doing messing around near the cliffs anyway. I feel sorry for his family and friends, but I do think there was some stupidity involved in being anywhere near the top of the cliffs.

[hr]

Well, I bet that you look good on the dancefloor

[Al]

"Would the same thread about two young teenage girls killed at a railway crossing (knwoing a train was nearby) have contained the same ridicule & mockery?"

But the two situations are not really analogous. The girls had to use the crossing. There was absolutely no need for the student to be arsing around at the top of the cliff.

[KateBush]

I'm not from the political correctness brigade. But I did find GRez or whatever his/her name was REALLY offensive, and I'm sure he must have broken Sinner rules of decorum/decency etc. That sort of thing shouldn't even be said in jest.It really was in poor taste. S/he should be really embarrassed and ashamed.

[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/vasovagalvegan/
POTS and Vasovagal Syncope- not for the *faint* hearted
See me in my wheelchair? Keep staring--I might do a trick!

[Grandpa]

Quoting maz from 15:50, 4th Jan 2006
To be honest my first thoughts were a bit along the lines of "silly bugger". It is very sad that a young life has been lost. But from the initial facts I heard, someone in a position to be falling of the cliffs at 2am has probably been drinking, it's not like the cliffs are somewhere you are likely to be at 2am. What was he doing messing around near the cliffs anyway. I feel sorry for his family and friends, but I do think there was some stupidity involved in being anywhere near the top of the cliffs.

True, Maz, true - about the silly bugger etc.

But also, I've looked over that wall a few times and it strikes me that, even thought there is a wall, the plants growing on the other side give the illusion that there is a lot of ground there. I eventually came to the conclusion that anyone who does climb over there at night, yes, must have been drinking and may well have wanted to 'relieve' themselves.

I can see people saying 'then why not wait till there's a tiolet to use' but bravado, as we all know, is increased with alcohol consumption, and thus I think the better thing may be for the council, RSPA, or whoever to put up a big big sign, well lit, that says words to the effect that there are sheer cliffs under the undergrowth and that death is certain if you climb over.



[hr]

[s]Cogitationis poenam nemo meretur, facias ipse quod faciamus suades - pax vobiscum.[/s]

[DrAlex]

Quoting Paranoid from 15:17, 4th Jan 2006
I've lost total respect for the administration of this message board if a thread such as this has not been considered for deletion, lesser threads have been removed in the past, albeit the distant past (the Sinner's standards have dropped so badly over the last 4 years). Just because 'its the norm' these days doesn't mean its right

The thread as a whole certainly doesn't warrant deletion. Someone was merely sharing a news story. As for some of the rather tasteless remarks, I'm on vacation so I didn't see them before everyone else had, so what's the point?

Besides, I feel that it's more often better to show someone how stupid they're being through allowing responses to their posts, rather than deleting it...

[hr]

La loi est dure, mais l'aigle ne chasse pas les mouches.
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37100343

[exnihilo]

Personally, I would have considered deletion of this thread to be gratuitously heavy-handed. I'm glad it was left alone.

[Mohawk]

Now, i can't help thinking we are all being a little over the top here. Yes it is a tragedy that such a young life has been lost. Hell, he was the same age as me, and yeah, thats young. He probably had the rest of his life planned out, and my condolences go out to the guys family

But the fact remains : Why was he arsing around cliffs that are CLEARLY marked "Dangerous Cliffs" or something along those lines? He would have had to climb over the railings to have got into such a situation
Furthermore, i can't help thinking that had this been on the Darwin awards or something we would all be laughing at this poor chap.

I think the facfact that it has happened so close to home and we share a common empathy has meant we have joined together, apart from the odd twat (Grez i'm looking at you here)

[Guest]

Near where I live there was a 17 year old killed who drove round a corner too quickly and hit another car and a wall. I found it insane that people had any sympathy for the guy. He chose to do something dangerous by driving round a corner too fast.

The guy on the cliff chose to do something dangerous as well. It was their own fault they died and no one elses. Anyone who has any sympathy for them is just full of it frankly.

[Reggy]

Did you capatalise the pun intentionally in the first line? I wonder if simply writing a pun like that, intentional or not, would be greeted with the same reaction as Grez's comments - I hope not. Its been said enough times already but Grez you really are a sad case.

[Mohawk]

Quoting Reggy from 17:32, 4th Jan 2006
Did you capatalise the pun intentionally in the first line?

apologies, no i didn't type it intentionally, it has been edited

[the reason for the word w]

Quoting from 14:53, 4th Jan 2006
Near where I live there was a 17 year old killed who drove round a corner too quickly and hit another car and a wall. I found it insane that people had any sympathy for the guy. He chose to do something dangerous by driving round a corner too fast.

The guy on the cliff chose to do something dangerous as well. It was their own fault they died and no one elses. Anyone who has any sympathy for them is just full of it frankly.

This makes it sound like people who cause their own death out of carelessness or "stupidity" deserved to die. That's rather dangerous territory. If you continue down this slippery slope, you'd have to say someone who has unsafe sex and gets infected with HIV and dies should not be griefed for, since it was his (or her) own fault. This would also mean showing no sympathy for people who end up in a wheelchair after crashing their car, because they drove too fast on an icy road, for example. Most people (of course I don't know about you) are only human and make mistakes. I find it quite near-sighted to argue the way you do, since you might well find yourself in a miserable situation you have brought about yourself and I am sure you would enjoy people turning their backs on you, saying "what do I care, it was his own fault"!

[hr]

Are you a terrorist?
- Depends! Are you terrified?

[novium]

copious amounts of alcohol probably had something to do it. Being drunk makes anyone stupid.

Quoting Mohawk from 17:12, 4th Jan 2006

But the fact remains : Why was he arsing around cliffs that are CLEARLY marked "Dangerous Cliffs" or something along those lines? He would have had to climb over the railings to have got into such a situation

[hr]

quo vobis mentes, rectae quae stare solebant antehac, dementis sese flexere viai?

[Midget]

I'm very glad this thread hasn't been censored it has been a very interesting debate. I think in many ways both siedes are right, it was in some sense a "stupid" accident, but probably due to alcohol, (many of us have done reckless things while under the influence) but it was certainly "tragic", someone that young and so on.

The links to Fife Constabulary (in the news website) are quite funny. Particularly the kids section which is all about drugs and alcohol with a handy quiz to check you know the facts. I got 12/13 for the alcohol one.

[hr]

IMAGE:img9.imgspot.com/u/04/241/18/160019.jpg Too far.