Another one falls off the cliffs

[Paranoid]

Ok its a decent debate over decency and levels of acceptability, but how about this for consideration:


* The person who drove round a corner too fast turns out to be a newly qualified driver who went round one of the corners on the approach to St.A from Guardbridge too fast. Now forgive me for being sensitive but that was one f*cking decieving road where those who are used to it drive at unbelieavable speeds, and those who have never seen it before can/would/should be forgiven for misjudging a corner (especially if inexperienced with driving small roads)

* Now this is a version of events that I've heard directly from St.A. This young chap who fell over the cliff in St.A was not intoxicated in any way and was in fact trying to take a photo of St.A in the night from the wall bordering on the cliff overlooking the Aquarium (or thereabouts). Given the circumstances, sure you can claim stupidity, but before pointing the finger I think the majority of us should look at ourselves and compare his actions to our own, I'm sure the majority (myself included) have adopted similar 'dangerous' positions in the past - drunk or not.

Personally I find it disgusting that such a thread has continued for so long and with the (assumed) admin claiming that 'its been there for too long for me to take it away' is very unprofessional. I'm sure if it was any of your own siblings who had died (again, intoxicated or not) this thread would have been censored (not the same as deletion) at the very least. Debating over the level of safety for intoxicated persons on the Scores is one thing, debating over the life of a person we have never met is another!!!

[hr]

..I've got this pain down all the diodes on my left side...

[Mod]

Quoting Paranoid from 00:40, 5th Jan 2006and with the (assumed) admin claiming that 'its been there for too long for me to take it away' is very unprofessional.

No, he was quite right. when a thread's more than a few messages long, it becomes extremely difficult to delete. And the moderators aren't professional, they do this in their free time, for free. And given the amount of crap you don't see, that goes on, you shouldn't really complain. I've been over this in the past. If a moderator were to delete the thread, someone would whine on about freedom of speech, etc.

[Admin]

Quoting Paranoid from 00:40, 5th Jan 2006
Personally I find it disgusting that such a thread has continued for so long and with the (assumed) admin claiming that 'its been there for too long for me to take it away' is very unprofessional. I'm sure if it was any of your own siblings who had died (again, intoxicated or not) this thread would have been censored (not the same as deletion) at the very least. Debating over the level of safety for intoxicated persons on the Scores is one thing, debating over the life of a person we have never met is another!!!

I did consider removing the thread, but then I realised that some comments from users far outweighed those of Grez (who some may have noticed has been banned for his comments).
Perhaps this raises the question of whether stupid/offensive/annoying users should be banned from The Sinner? Let's start that on another thread eh? -


Removing a whole thread is actually very simple, regardless of how long it's been going.

Anyway I reserve the right to remove any content from The Sinner at any time for any reason (it's my site - I'll do what I want with it).

Edited because admin missed a /quote tag

[Duggeh]

youre all a bunch of loonies

[hr]

IMAGE:www.macintyre42.plus.com/images/tb2-100.jpg
Duggeh: Master Of Ceremonies
[s]http://www.thismanwillkillyou.com[/s]

[KateBush]

has that GRez numpty been banned? Atleast admin showed sense THERE.

[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/vasovagalvegan/
POTS and Vasovagal Syncope- not for the *faint* hearted
See me in my wheelchair? Keep staring--I might do a trick!

[Mod]

Quoting admin from 02:27, 5th Jan 2006

Removing a whole thread is actually very simple, regardless of how long it's been going.

Easy for you, incredibly laborious for myself and other mods

[Mohawk]

[exnihilo]

Quoting the reason for the word witch from 23:34, 4th Jan 2006
This makes it sound like people who cause their own death out of carelessness or "stupidity" deserved to die. That's rather dangerous territory. If you continue down this slippery slope, you'd have to say someone who has unsafe sex and gets infected with HIV and dies should not be griefed for, since it was his (or her) own fault. This would also mean showing no sympathy for people who end up in a wheelchair after crashing their car, because they drove too fast on an icy road, for example.

Neither one of those follow from the example in question; this slippery slope argument, like all slippery slope arguments, is utter tosh.

[__Sam__]

Quoting katebush from 03:07, 5th Jan 2006
has that GRez numpty been banned? Atleast admin showed sense THERE.

[hr]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/vasovagalvegan/
POTS and Vasovagal Syncope- not for the *faint* hearted
See me in my wheelchair? Keep staring--I might do a trick!

I too would like to know if he/she has been banned, if not I propose he/she is.

[the reason for the word w]

Quoting exnihilo from 12:31, 5th Jan 2006

Quoting the reason for the word witch from 23:34, 4th Jan 2006
This makes it sound like people who cause their own death out of carelessness or "stupidity" deserved to die. That's rather dangerous territory. If you continue down this slippery slope, you'd have to say someone who has unsafe sex and gets infected with HIV and dies should not be griefed for, since it was his (or her) own fault. This would also mean showing no sympathy for people who end up in a wheelchair after crashing their car, because they drove too fast on an icy road, for example.

Neither one of those follow from the example in question; this slippery slope argument, like all slippery slope arguments, is utter tosh.

And... we disagree...

[hr]

Are you a terrorist?
- Depends! Are you terrified?

[Maria]

why shouldn't we laugh at death? It's important, it takes away some of our fear of mortality. And seriously, sometimes people doing stupid things is funny, I still chuckle when i remember a story i read about a stuntman dying when he bungee jumped with a rope that was too long.....hee hee, see it makes me giggle al over again! and i refuse to believe I'm a sick person because i find that amusing. so there. bet half of you lot chuckle at the idea.

[hr]

a horse divided against itself cannot stand

[flarewearer]

Exactly, Maria, you aren't sick and / or twisted if you laugh at the Darwin awards, just a normal, well adjusted person. I for one find them highly amusing.

[hr]

image:www.magnificentoctopus.com/x/elgar.png

[Rufus]

I wouldn't argue with that.

What really rankled me, however, was how much of a unfeeling tosser (excuse my French) Grez/Mohawk/whatever was capable of being.

There is a difference between being sick for the sake of it and being sick to be amusing.

Ah, blah, dear me.

[hr]

'Love much. Earth has enough bitter in it'
Ella Wheeler Wilcox

[Stu]

But the fact remains : Why was he arsing around cliffs that are CLEARLY marked "Dangerous Cliffs" or something along those lines? He would have had to climb over the railings to have got into such a situation

According to a press report the nearest warning sign had been removed by vandals.

If you look at the photograph in the link there's certainly nothing to suggest any imminent danger to someone who doesn't know the area. The top of the wall also looks a lot narrower than you might expect if you were standing at right angles to it, particuarly if you're not that tall.

Now imagine that you've just arrived in St Andrews, you're down there late at night (and it's quite dark in that spot) then climbing the wall might seem slightly risky, but hardly reckless.

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/output/2006 ... 4684t0.asp

[Guest]

This happened near Auchterarder. The person in question wrote off a car doing exactly the same thing on 6 Nov. On 6 Dec he had exactly the same accident again and killed himself. Still have any sympathy for him.

I believe that when one makes a choice to do something you know is dangerous, one should face the consequences of ones actions. So I would not expect any help or sympathy if I did something I knew was dangerous and seriously injured myself doing it.

Quoting Paranoid from 00:40, 5th Jan 2006
Ok its a decent debate over decency and levels of acceptability, but how about this for consideration:


* The person who drove round a corner too fast turns out to be a newly qualified driver who went round one of the corners on the approach to St.A from Guardbridge too fast. Now forgive me for being sensitive but that was one f*cking decieving road where those who are used to it drive at unbelieavable speeds, and those who have never seen it before can/would/should be forgiven for misjudging a corner (especially if inexperienced with driving small roads)

* Now this is a version of events that I've heard directly from St.A. This young chap who fell over the cliff in St.A was not intoxicated in any way and was in fact trying to take a photo of St.A in the night from the wall bordering on the cliff overlooking the Aquarium (or thereabouts). Given the circumstances, sure you can claim stupidity, but before pointing the finger I think the majority of us should look at ourselves and compare his actions to our own, I'm sure the majority (myself included) have adopted similar 'dangerous' positions in the past - drunk or not.

Personally I find it disgusting that such a thread has continued for so long and with the (assumed) admin claiming that 'its been there for too long for me to take it away' is very unprofessional. I'm sure if it was any of your own siblings who had died (again, intoxicated or not) this thread would have been censored (not the same as deletion) at the very least. Debating over the level of safety for intoxicated persons on the Scores is one thing, debating over the life of a person we have never met is another!!!

[hr]

..I've got this pain down all the diodes on my left side...

[trollope fan]

It irritates me that certain self righteous people can kick up such a fuss over a stupid comment (that was perhaps better not made) and cause someone to be banned.

At the end of the day, Grez (unless he has done something else) only made a poor joke in bad taste. If that joke had been about Rod Hull in the week after he died then would the same action have been taken?

Incidentally, on a separate note why is it wrong to speak ill of the dead? You can criticise someone in life but not in death? It is okay to say Tony Blair is a wanker when he is not here to respond and defend himself, or am I wrong about that? You have never spoken about friends when they are not there?
It is fine to criticise a deceased evil man for being evil but no one else who is deceased should ever be criticised?

[flarewearer]

Quoting Stu from 02:00, 5th Jan 2006

According to a press report the nearest warning sign had been removed by vandals.

Climbing over a fence onto the top of a cliff does not require warning that there may be imminent danger ahead...

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image:www.magnificentoctopus.com/x/elgar.png

[exnihilo]

Quoting the reason for the word witch from 15:15, 5th Jan 2006And... we disagree...

Fair enough, but slippery slope arguments are all rot, speculation at best and scaremongering at worst; and are, consequently, barely worthy of acknowledgment when raised in arguments.

[Cain]

one minute exnihilo is dismissing slippery slope arguments, the nex thing you know there won't be any argument on the sinner!

[hr]

I hold an element of surprise

[exnihilo]

Grr.