Association Elections October 2006

[exnihilo]

You don't correct people who misspell or mispronounce your name? Or does your anti-pedant stance forbid you?

Getting things right is not pedantry, taking it to extremes is.

[RJ Covino]

Quoting exnihilo from 23:22, 13th Oct 2006
(Edit: PS I'm surprised to hear you claiming credit, Ralph, for what is, frankly, an administrative abortion.)

Oh, don't get me wrong. The execution of the present system is an abomination and has been for yonks. However, I feel that the problems are more down to a lack of adequate leadership than ones inherent in the design. A small distinction, but a telling one.

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http://www.ralphcovino.com

[Al]

Quoting elections officer from 18:55, 13th Oct 2006
They will be co-opted at a future SRC. Member posts can be co-opted, but officer positions have to be filled by an election.

That doesn't seem to fit very well with the new, unimproved version of RON.

[Jono]

Quoting exnihilo from 01:30, 14th Oct 2006
You don't correct people who misspell or mispronounce your name? Or does your anti-pedant stance forbid you?

Getting things right is not pedantry, taking it to extremes is.

My name is misspelled in such new and interesting ways each time it's written, I've just given up.

In other news, I should stop leaving my browser window open for myself to find when drunk!

[hr]

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[Jono]

I agree, the election rules are stupid. All they do is create a sanatised, uninteresting version of electioneering. I don't see why candidates shouldn't just get a budget, do whatever the hell they like with it, and have to account for it all afterwards.

Furthermore, the regulation of the Sinner, facebook and other fun things that the union does not own is completely unjustified. Peanalising people for making use of free media sources is complete and utter foolishness. We have a problem with people not turning out to vote, and I think part of the problem is that students are isolated from all the things that make electioneering so much fun!

[hr]

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[exnihilo]

Indeed, there's practically nowhere left to put a poster, most halls have banned flyering and won't let candidates address meals anymore, emails aren't allowed, and everyone hates the gauntlet outside the polls. It's utterly contrary to the hoped for aim.

[maenad]

I would love electronic resources to be allowed. I loathe posters and flyering. I don't see one and think, 'Hey, they look like a good candidate'. I think, 'Wow, that was a lot of trees' and 'I bet most people don't recycle'. Will the environmental rep be flyering?

[hr]

Tommy can you hear me?

[Elections Officer]

Hopefully the link-up to all current students will be working again, but for those interested in the hecklings, the times can be found here:

http://www.yourunion.net/files/Heckling ... r%2006.pdf

All the best,

Adam Fellows
Senior Elections Officer

[hr]

Election Officers Committee
University of St Andrews Students' Association
St Mary's Place
St Andrews
KY16 9UZ

[David Bean]

Actually the vast bulk of election materials are recycled, because there are recycling bins beside the polls (which candidates often raid to get more of their own flyers to give out a second time - I know I used to), and as for posters, well, in most university departments these days there are more recycling than there are waste bins, so the posters go into them as a matter of course.

I'm in favour of making Facebook a campaigning free-for-all zone, though many of the rules relating to the sinner were imposed by Oli, not the election officers - and as for negative campaigning, I hardly think that that would do anything to increase turnout since all everybody would do is start to bitch about how candidates don't play fair with each other.

What I do think is that the Sabb hecklings should be replaced with a US primary-style debate between all the candidates, for the duration of which the rules surrounding negative campaigning would be suspended. If it were possible to schedule them earlier in the week, and allow free and fair reporting of what was said (including a compact with the Saint that they would report it adequately), that should at least allow some degree of criticism.

As for 'Mr Spires', I know full well how to spell his name - actually it's f-l-e-t-c=h-e-r-w-a-t-s-o-n now - but i was making a rather obscure dig at the Union signpainter who thought he was a collection of church tops. And as for the SRC, I stand by my previous remarks - he as good as said he was trying to mess it up.

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Psalm 91:7

[Midget]

Bean well said, a big debate!

Imagine: Preston, Dardar, Anders, Bonnie, Moroso and Me, -that would have been fun. Although I think it would have ended with Dardar Anders Moroso and trying and failing to stop someone getting seriously hurt.

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IMAGE:img9.imgspot.com/u/04/241/18/160019.jpg "Little!"
http://standrews.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37100090

[classydriver]

Quoting David Bean from 17:15, 15th Oct 2006

I'm in favour of making Facebook a campaigning free-for-all zone, though many of the rules relating to the sinner were imposed by Oli, not the election officers - and as for negative campaigning, I hardly think that that would do anything to increase turnout since all everybody would do is start to bitch about how candidates don't play fair with each other.

I don't agree with your facebook comment David. At the point we are at now, in terms of the sheer number of students who are members of facebook, it is a good way of informing the wider student body that

a) Elections are happening
b) The various organised events, eg Hecklings
c) To raise the profiles of the candidates in question.

Yes, I agree that there are problems inheriant with this method and the potential 'unlevelling of the playing field' as it were but I'm sure there would be ways of combating that.

I would argue that it is better for the candidates to use such tools in a way that informs the electing body of who they are and what they stand for. A completed facebook profile is a far fuller Declaration of Interests than what is currently asked for by the Elections Officers Committee.

What I do think is that the Sabb hecklings should be replaced with a US primary-style debate between all the candidates...

This was an idea that was raised when Laura MacPherson was Senior Elections Officer a couple of years ago. The problem is when you have 10 Presidential candidates (as it was that particular year) how do you manage it in a productive and informative way that allows the voting body to make the decision that ultimately they have to come to. I know you that what you are going to suggest is a competent chair (maybe one who smokes cigars on the job!!) but I can see it being nothing more than a circus.

[classydriver]

Quoting David Bean from 17:15, 15th Oct 2006

I'm in favour of making Facebook a campaigning free-for-all zone, though many of the rules relating to the sinner were imposed by Oli, not the election officers - and as for negative campaigning, I hardly think that that would do anything to increase turnout since all everybody would do is start to bitch about how candidates don't play fair with each other.

I don't agree with your facebook comment David. At the point we are at now, in terms of the sheer number of students who are members of facebook, it is a good way of informing the wider student body that

a) Elections are happening
b) The various organised events, eg Hecklings
c) To raise the profiles of the candidates in question.

Yes, I agree that there are problems inheriant with this method and the potential 'unlevelling of the playing field' as it were but I'm sure there would be ways of combating that.

I would argue that it is better for the candidates to use such tools in a way that informs the electing body of who they are and what they stand for. A completed facebook profile is a far fuller Declaration of Interests than what is currently asked for by the Elections Officers Committee.

What I do think is that the Sabb hecklings should be replaced with a US primary-style debate between all the candidates...

This was an idea that was raised when Laura MacPherson was Senior Elections Officer a couple of years ago. The problem is when you have 10 Presidential candidates (as it was that particular year) how do you manage it in a productive and informative way that allows the voting body to make the decision that ultimately they have to come to. I know you that what you are going to suggest is a competent chair (maybe one who smokes cigars on the job!!) but I can see it being nothing more than a circus.

[Jono]

On leveling the playing field; What's the point? Some candidates are inherently better than others from day one, and I think there should be means of expressing that without being shat on from above. You may have one candidate who's going for a post. They have prior experience on various committies, and the did a good job on them, and have proven themselves compitant and hard working individuals. Versus some complete wastrell who's only there for the crack, or for the CV. Artificially bridging the gap, I feel, is far more damaging to the election process than potential breaches of an ambiguous and rose-tinted "election spirit."

Also on facebook, there is a real danger that people could use the regulations to sabotage campaigns. If the admin of, say the "If I don't remember it doesn't count" group decided he dislikes a paticular candidate, all he needs to do is mass email the group in support of said candidate. Lo and behold, Illegal advertising, said candidate gets disqualified! The Association cannot insulate the elections from this kind of abuse because they have no power on facebook. Ergo, surely it's safer to de-regulate it.
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[exnihilo]

Exactly. This nonsense about punishing a candidate for things done by other people in support of him or her is totally unpoliceable.

[David Bean]

I agree with Jono and exnihilo about Facebook: as an election officer last year I know how hard it is to avoid a situation where candidates spend more time trying to get their opponents disqualified than they do winning votes, and with restrictive rules on Facebook, it's a nightmare - how can a candidate reasonably be expected, regardless of what the rules say, to prevent every single member of his campaign team (which, in the case of sabb campaigns and some others I've run, can be huge)? That's the main reason why I'd say, abolish the restrictions completely, perhaps with the exception of buying paid ads if we wanted to do that.

On running a sabb debate, I can't answer right now exactly how it would be achieved, but I mentioned US primaries specifically because they manage multiple candidates with those, and it wouldn't be hard to take a look at how the do it, and then replicate it. And as for cigar-smoking chairs, mea culpa, but unfortunately short of holding them outside it wouldn't really be very feasible today...

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Psalm 91:7

[maenad]

Quoting David Bean from 17:15, 15th Oct 2006
Actually the vast bulk of election materials are recycled, because there are recycling bins beside the polls (which candidates often raid to get more of their own flyers to give out a second time - I know I used to), and as for posters, well, in most university departments these days there are more recycling than there are waste bins, so the posters go into them as a matter of course.

True, but it would be more energy efficient not to waste the trees in the first place.

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Tommy can you hear me?