How to make Union elections interesting

[Al]

Of course the SRC should be representative. But it should also mean something to people. At the moment it doesn't seem to be able to be either. You have a situation where anyone stand for whatever post they like whether they will be able to adequately represent their constituents or not. In the days of specific constituency reps being elected solely by members of that consituency, there was an added onus on them to do their job. They could be recalled. Now, when every student can vote for every post, that has been lost.

There is also the problem that so many of the posts are so vague as to be meaningless. People just don't seem to know what these posts are for, and that is as true of the holders as it is of the general student population. At the last election, I was struck by how many candidates managed to have campaign profiles on Facebook without ever once mentioning the remit of their post. Sure they talked about what they'd do on SRC but that seldom had any connection with their post. People are finding it too easy to get on the SRC. Some of them didn't even know what the SRC is and what it does.

[Ben Reilly]

Quoting Lid from 23:37, 3rd Jan 2008

Well then it's impressive how these myths perpetuate - it was something I was told in my first SRC member training by the then head of HR / DoR, I forget which.

It wasn't me. I could have told you that 1994 EA says:

"appointment to major union offices should be by election in a secret ballot in which all members are entitled to vote".

Part 2, Section 22, Para 2D.

It then does not go onto define what a major union (in the EA sense) office means. At some unis, not all sabbaticals are elected cross-campus.

I'm not going to comment on the wider discussion.

[Tweedle-Dum]

How far do you think we'd get claiming we weren't a major union, therefore we don't need campus wide elections for the offices?


[hr]

Tetragrammaton is a four letter word.

[exnihilo]

Ahem, "major union offices" not "major union" offices. Keep up. Which is to say major offices in a given union as opposed to offices within a major union.

[Jono]

The problem isn't the quantity of positions, or the number of elections. I think the reason elections are so unpopular is that the entire union governmental structure is totally incomprehensible to anyone on the outside! I’ve sat here reading through this thread, and barely understood a word of what anyone’s been saying. I doubt I’m the only one.

These problems are exasperated by lack of communications. Is SRC member for X,Y or Z pointless? I don’t know! I haven’t got a clue what they’re doing (or don’t do), because I can’t get hold of records of what they’ve done very easily! Sadly, communication between the Association, and the general membership (with a few exceptions, e.g. James’ frequent accommodation updates) is still very poor. Special meetings (if they’re advertised at all), only appear on the Email uplink (something so over-stuffed with information, you can’t see the trees for the forest), while weekly business is never re-announced. The only thing I could get from the website were the minutes from one SRC meeting back in October (the one with the defeated motion on RBS). There’s no link to the constitution, sub-committee minutes, or anything else! Very few officers make an effort to communicate what they’re doing (if they are, I can’t find it on the website)! Is it any wonder that people criticise the minor positions as little more than cosy apprenticeships for the major-league positions a few years down the line?

What we have now is a system that encourages the minority who already hold offices and know what’s going on, while putting everyone else off the idea of running. I don’t ever imagine we’ll ever get anything close to 100% turnout in the elections (student apathy is as old as the hills after all). But if we want any improvement; it has to start with greater transparency. Putting up the dates of meetings on the website, and keeping information regarding union government, committee minutes, and the activities of our elected officers updated can bring nothing but improvement. It means more people scrutinising these allegedly pointless offices. More people looking into these allegedly spurious bureaucratic structures. Finally, and ultimately, encouraging more people to get involved with the union government; both at a grassroots level, and by standing for elections.

[James Shield]

Quoting Jono from 18:19, 6th Jan 2008
Sadly, communication between the Association, and the general membership (with a few exceptions, e.g. James’ frequent accommodation updates) is still very poor.

I agree, and this is why I wrote and proposed the following motion, which was passed by SRC at the end of November:
http://yourunion.net/files/Motion_to_th ... cation.pdf

Unfortunately the SRC is being pretty slow on the uptake of the measures outlined in that motion, though I intend to do more hassling after the exams.

Minutes etc would most likely be found on sub-committee Facebook groups and pages on the Union's website, though the regularity with which they are updated often leaves much to be desired. They are also quite difficult to find on the Union site, though this page really ought to be the hub of everything the SRC does:
http://www.yourunion.net/content/index.php?page=4394


Accommodation Committee
http://standrews.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2215621182
http://www.yourunion.net/content/index.php?page=4386

Education Committee
http://standrews.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2202559424
http://yourunion.net/education

Environment & Ethics Committee
http://standrews.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2260489973
http://yourunion.net/eande

Equal Opportunities & Welfare Committee
http://standrews.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2202324576
http://www.yourunion.net/content/index.php?page=4400

Steve Savage now writes a weekly Representation News article for the Union site which also appears in the (admittedly bloated but increasingly streamlined) Linkup email. Here's the more recent one:
http://www.yourunion.net/news/index.php ... ws_id=7259

Overall, you're correct that there are lots of improvements to be made. Hopefully we'll see lots more progress over the coming months.

[Bizarre Atheist]

Stunning - well done James. I shall peruse these at my leisure, and offer in return

www.yourunion.net/charities

and invite you to select 'Minutes' from the left-hand bar.[img]littleicons/grin.gif[/img]

[hr]

[Bizarre Atheist]

Quoting James Shield from 18:50, 6th Jan 2008
Accommodation Committee
http://www.yourunion.net/content/index.php?page=4386

Last minutes are from 29 November 2007

Education Committee
http://yourunion.net/education

Last minutes are from 24 April 2007

Environment & Ethics Committee
http://yourunion.net/eande

'MINUTES COMING SOON'

Equal Opportunities & Welfare Committee
http://www.yourunion.net/content/index.php?page=4400

Not even a pretence at providing minutes. Last update 12/2/2007.

[hr]

[Bizarre Atheist]

Quoting Jono from 18:19, 6th Jan 2008
The problem is the quantity of positions, or the number of elections. I think the reason elections are so unpopular is that the entire union governmental structure is totally incomprehensible to anyone on the outside!

Woah there Jono, you've strayed back on topic!

I’ve sat here reading through this thread, and barely understood a word of what anyone’s been saying. I doubt I’m the only one.

I'm a trustee of the whole damn thing and some things have been discussed that have gone right over my head. This is my fault, really. However it illustrates the fact that the transitory and complex nature of the organisation does not lend itself to people easily involving themselves. I see the solution as being one that has been discussed in various forms here; a strategic, but merciless, cull of the system, starting with the SRC and then generally simplifying the whole shebang. I hope our new general manager will do a lot to influence this and generally create a 'vision' for the future.

I make no apology for the fact that this is my third post on this thread in about six minutes.

[hr]

[duckgirl]

I'm not really sure that it's the remit of the General Manager to 'influence' the SRC with his 'vision'. Why do you think that, and why would you want to see someone who is employed to oversee the management of the building directing the future of a student representative body? Seems a strange mixture to me.

Quoting Bizarre Atheist from 19:15, 6th Jan 2008

Quoting Jono from 18:19, 6th Jan 2008
The problem is the quantity of positions, or the number of elections. I think the reason elections are so unpopular is that the entire union governmental structure is totally incomprehensible to anyone on the outside!

Woah there Jono, you've strayed back on topic!

I’ve sat here reading through this thread, and barely understood a word of what anyone’s been saying. I doubt I’m the only one.

I'm a trustee of the whole damn thing and some things have been discussed that have gone right over my head. This is my fault, really. However it illustrates the fact that the transitory and complex nature of the organisation does not lend itself to people easily involving themselves. I see the solution as being one that has been discussed in various forms here; a strategic, but merciless, cull of the system, starting with the SRC and then generally simplifying the whole shebang. I hope our new general manager will do a lot to influence this and generally create a 'vision' for the future.

I make no apology for the fact that this is my third post on this thread in about six minutes.

[hr]

[Bizarre Atheist]

Quoting duckgirl from 19:28, 6th Jan 2008
I'm not really sure that it's the remit of the General Manager to 'influence' the SRC with his 'vision'. Why do you think that, and why would you want to see someone who is employed to oversee the management of the building directing the future of a student representative body? Seems a strange mixture to me.

Because one of the purposes of a GM is to provide a continuity and sustainability that a constant turnover of students cannot. As long as the SRC is Union-housed and Union-funded, it should be developed and guided just like the SSC, rather than, to quote a recent poster, allowing 'hippy students to rule the roost', by which I mean letting self-important CV padders do whatever they please whilst proclaiming 'leave me alone! I'm representing students!!'

NB this exaggeration is meant in jest.

[hr]

[James Shield]

Quoting Bizarre Atheist from 19:03, 6th Jan 2008

Quoting James Shield from 18:50, 6th Jan 2008
Accommodation Committee
http://www.yourunion.net/content/index.php?page=4386

Last minutes are from 29 November 2007 [and so on]

Like I said, there are still big improvements to be made, not only regarding our website but in the way we conduct meetings. Part of the problem is the very limited and always-overdue training we receive, as well as the fact that the Director of Representation is the one who is meant to take minutes in SRC sub-committee meetings rather than a proper minute secretary (this is hopefully getting sorted soon).

[BenEsq]

Quoting Bizarre Atheist from 19:49, 6th Jan 2008

Quoting duckgirl from 19:28, 6th Jan 2008
I'm not really sure that it's the remit of the General Manager to 'influence' the SRC with his 'vision'. Why do you think that, and why would you want to see someone who is employed to oversee the management of the building directing the future of a student representative body? Seems a strange mixture to me.

Because one of the purposes of a GM is to provide a continuity and sustainability that a constant turnover of students cannot. As long as the SRC is Union-housed and Union-funded, it should be developed and guided just like the SSC, rather than, to quote a recent poster, allowing 'hippy students to rule the roost', by which I mean letting self-important CV padders do whatever they please whilst proclaiming 'leave me alone! I'm representing students!!'

NB this exaggeration is meant in jest.

[hr]

Dictatorship by men of Kent, anyone?

[hr]

Lions and tigers and bears...Oh my!

[Bizarre Atheist]

Quoting BenEsq from 20:19, 6th Jan 2008
Dictatorship by men of Kent, anyone?

Huzzah!

[hr]

[James Shield]

Quoting Jono from 18:19, 6th Jan 2008
The only thing I could get from the website were the minutes from one SRC meeting back in October (the one with the defeated motion on RBS).

I don't have access to change the 'SRC minutes' page, however I can provide the minutes of every SRC meeting since the Spring vacation courtesy of the shiny accommodation committee webpage:

http://www.yourunion.net/content/index.php?page=19005

[duckgirl]

That doesn't make any sense.
You're talking about lots of different problems and confusing them all together. It sounds like you're about to suggest that the General Manager (employed by a board not elected by students) tell SRC members/officers what they should do, and direct their activities.

Quoting Bizarre Atheist from 19:49, 6th Jan 2008

Quoting duckgirl from 19:28, 6th Jan 2008
I'm not really sure that it's the remit of the General Manager to 'influence' the SRC with his 'vision'. Why do you think that, and why would you want to see someone who is employed to oversee the management of the building directing the future of a student representative body? Seems a strange mixture to me.

Because one of the purposes of a GM is to provide a continuity and sustainability that a constant turnover of students cannot. As long as the SRC is Union-housed and Union-funded, it should be developed and guided just like the SSC, rather than, to quote a recent poster, allowing 'hippy students to rule the roost', by which I mean letting self-important CV padders do whatever they please whilst proclaiming 'leave me alone! I'm representing students!!'

NB this exaggeration is meant in jest.

[hr]

[Bizarre Atheist]

I'm not suggesting for one minute that the GM should be a policy-forming puppet master, I was merely observing that the position is one of very few constants in an ever-shifting organisation, and that his experience might be more valuable than a system whereby we mash up the constitution every six months.

I do regret tagging such an observation on the end of a post - it has rather detracted from the thrust of my argument. Namely, the value of a totalitarian government of Kentish Men and Men of Kent.

[hr]

[Bizarre Atheist]

I'm not suggesting for one minute that the GM should be an SRC policy-forming puppet master, I was merely observing that the position is one of very few constants in an ever-shifting organisation, and that his experience might be more valuable than a system whereby we mash up the constitution every six months - something Bruce warns us against vocally in relation to SSC behaviour.

I do regret tagging such an observation on the end of a post - it has rather detracted from the thrust of my argument. Namely, the value of a totalitarian government of Kentish Men and Men of Kent.

[RobFett]

I will put my hands up and apologise for the lack of minutes on my Education site. The simple fact is that I cannot write minutes at the same time as chairing a meeting. The DoR is usually there to write minutes but I think I have only had one of these emailed to me. Why is this? Because he has better things to do - all of the sabbaticals are working something like 12 hour days 6 days a week (despite the working time directive)for tuppence and still don't get everything done they need to. There was a plan to get the general office secretaries to do minutes but we are still waiting for that to happen (now we have a new GM there is light at the end of the tunnel). Also, I find it very hard to do my publicity for my events because the Oli Walker also has too much on his plate.

We need:
- a couple more Sabbs
- an extra design officer
- secretaries to do minutes

Once that happens:
- minutes will get put up
- there will be more publicity
- more in general will get done
- mor people will know what's going on
- hopefully this will counter at least some of the apathy

How do we get all of this?
- the University needs to fund us properly.

Last semester the SRC passed a motion saying that should the University not agree to fund us appropriately then we would march to College Gate in protest. The deadline for University to do something was Christmas and as far as I am aware it has not yet agreed to further funding. Therefore, expect a march to College Gate in the very near future.

I also apologise for my lack of doing anything visible other than a book sale and academic misconduct campaign last semester. I'd like to do some work on National Representation but this is not something that the sabbaticals either do not have high up on their list of priorities or do not have the resources and national linkages to carry out. Also, only sabbs can attend meetings of CHESS (which represents you in Scotland).

A lot of the Education Officer's job is about internal work, which does effect you but you probably don't realise. FYI, I hope soon to discuss several matters with the Academic Registrar. However, she's currently doing the work that at least 5 people should be doing. So getting an appointment with her, will I fear, prove rather tricky. I would also like to get more feedback from class reps. But the majority of Director's of Teaching have been completely useless at communicating the names of their reps. And this means that quite frankly I don't know what you would like me to do.

Please feel free to email me on edu@

[RobFett]

To be fair, things are a lot better than a few years ago. I put a lot of this down to a better president who, through his two year term, had provided much needed continuity.