Leader of the Labour party

[DACrowe]

Nothing like a bit of photoshopping to make a 'first blessing' look like something more sinister.

Hey, that's cool. And the Hitler Youth photo... he was an extra on Mel Brooks' The Producers, right?

No, it was a fancy dress party at Oxford apparently. Ala Prince Harry.

[RedCelt69]

Nothing like a bit of photoshopping to make a 'first blessing' look like something more sinister.

Hey, that's cool. And the Hitler Youth photo... he was an extra on Mel Brooks' The Producers, right?

No, it was a fancy dress party at Oxford apparently. Ala Prince Harry.

Are you freshly-arrived home after an evening of drinking or did you really just confuse a reference to Ratzinger with a reference to Ed Balls? I'd guess that even the most ardent of Ed Balls' (hopefully few) supporters wouldn't describe the man as infallible.

Or was this a cunning ploy to get the thread back to the subject title? I can't help myself. A supporter of someone so easily mocked/admonished should be wary of trying to do likewise to potential Labour leaders. I mean... they're also easily mocked, but a phrase involving stones and greenhouses comes to mind.

PM Abbott would be cool. It'd show the Americans, eh? Yes, we beat you to having a female executive of state... and you have a black man... well, look at our black female Prime Minister, U S of A.

But they'll probably go for David Miliband.

But who in the hell wouldn't want to be a fly on the wall in the BNP's HQ if Diane Abbott won a general election? Tell me that that wouldn't be great.

[David Bean]

If I wished the Labour Party well, I'd plump for Dianne Abbot, the only candidate with a modicum of common sense. Even though she is regularly torn apart by Michael Portillo and our former Rector on This Week. I remember one edition, just before the election campaign started, when they were discussing the shocking prevalence of social deprivation around the country after 13 years of a Labour government; Portillo said, "Dianne would like to believe that things are still so bad because the Government hasn't been doing enough Labour things. The truth is, they've been doing as many Labour things as they could the whole time, but they haven't worked, because they don't." Diane's watertight rebuttal? "No, I don't think that's right, but... [changes the subject completely]."

If I were feeling optimistic, I'd plump for Ed Balls, who is almost certainly the worst of the lot - nobody more completely embodies the tin-pot, we-know-best control freakery of the last thirteen benighted years than that odious man. During the election campaign I spent some time in his new constituency of Morley and Outwood with his worthy Conservative opponent (and genuine Yorkshire lad!) Antony Calvert; we didn't quite manage the upset of the century, but we came pretty darned close. There's few good stories, but I especially remember canvassing one of the most deprived estates in the constituency, where nobody, but nobody, admitted to voting Labour. People were coming up to us in the street to wish us luck! I'd love Ed Balls to do that to his entire wretched party, but I just can't bring myself to believe they're that dumb.

So as I'm being realistic, when David Miliband's long campaign had turned sour - perhaps after his fifth bottling of a leadership challenge against Brown, or something like that (I lost count) - and his odds were down to 5/1, I put a small wager on him because I didn't honestly believe, under any circumstances, that the Labour Party would have the guts (or anatomical reference of reader's choice) to go for anyone else. He's the ultimate vanilla candidate, and just now, Labour is in the mood to play it exactly that safe.

[RedCelt69]

If I wished the Labour Party well, I'd plump for Dianne Abbot, the only candidate with a modicum of common sense. Even though she is regularly torn apart by Michael Portillo and our former Rector on This Week. I remember one edition, just before the election campaign started, when they were discussing the shocking prevalence of social deprivation around the country after 13 years of a Labour government; Portillo said, "Dianne would like to believe that things are still so bad because the Government hasn't been doing enough Labour things. The truth is, they've been doing as many Labour things as they could the whole time, but they haven't worked, because they don't." Diane's watertight rebuttal? "No, I don't think that's right, but... [changes the subject completely]."

You know that you're talking about an entertainment show, don't you? There's no hard-politicking on there by either party. They're friends... and friends knock each other - and, when those friends are politicians, they knock each other's parties. Portillo has also been equally lost on Conservative issues. I don't watch it thinking "Hah! Another point scored against the Tories!" Why? Because it is an entertainment show - an entertainment show with contributors who do not represent the mainstream elements of their political parties. Portillo failed at his bid for party leadership and, more than likely, Abbott will too.

when David Miliband's long campaign had turned sour - perhaps after his fifth bottling of a leadership challenge against Brown, or something like that (I lost count)

It is interesting to see someone call something "bottling" (and counting them!) when, from a different persepective, it might not be "bottling". Just as a throwaway possibility, here, but have you contemplated the idea that he values loyalty above his own political position? Disloyalty is remembered. Those who are disloyal are more likely to recieve it in return and, in a political party, enemies are very easily made by such a move. Sometimes, such enemies don't matter too much, but (and I'm just putting it out there as a possibility, as I'm not a mind-reader) perhaps David Miliband isn't comfortable with that generation of political life. Perhaps he isn't enough of a Tory?

The shorter reply to the above would be: don't judge others by your own poor standards.

He's the ultimate vanilla candidate, and just now, Labour is in the mood to play it exactly that safe.

David Bean, I'd like to introduce you to David Cameron and Nick Clegg. I would say that vanilla wins elections, but Cameron and Clegg didn't win much of anything... until they got together to make a double-nugget wafer.

Dianne Abbott isn't vanilla. She's chocolate with a liberal dousing of raspberry ripple. Hold the nuts.

[Hennessy]

Dianne Abbott isn't vanilla. She's chocolate with a liberal dousing of raspberry ripple. Hold the nuts.

#

She's big fat hypocrite flavour with the hot fudge of faux racial sensitivity poured all over. But more importantly she's black, and wouldn't that be an Obama-esque coup for cunning Mr Mandelson and the party spin machine, a black and female leader! Those poor fools who've spent the last 13 years having diversity and multiculturalism rammed down their throat won't be able to resist! Chocolate and pink, happy days!

[RedCelt69]

Dianne Abbott isn't vanilla. She's chocolate with a liberal dousing of raspberry ripple. Hold the nuts.

#

I did say to hold the nuts...

...rather than devolve into a bizzare anti-multicultarism, anti-gay Nick Griffin monologue. Which made no sense whatsoever. You think Abbott and Mandelson are political friends?

You strange little man.

[macgamer]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/newsnight/michaelcrick/2010/06/ed_miliband_says_no_to_mandels.html

I'm at the first Labour leadership hustings at the GMB conference in Southport.

And the very first question from the chair, Mary Turner?

"As Labour leader, would you invite Peter Mandelson to join your shadow cabinet?"

"All of us believe in dignity in retirement," replied Ed Miliband.

An interesting development that might put a bit more space between the Milibands. I wonder what Mandy's reaction might be.

http://www.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/6064183/the-prince-of-darkness-passes-into-night.thtml

If Ed Miliband wins, it’s curtains for Peter Mandelson. Michael Crick reports this exchange between GMB president Mary Turner and Ed Miliband.

"As Labour leader, would you invite Peter Mandelson to join your shadow cabinet?"

"All of us believe in dignity in retirement," replied Ed Miliband.’

Is Mordor mobilising? You bet your sweet life it is. No. In reality, I think that Mandelson, the uncompromising diarist, is finished with frontline Labour politics.

Are we entering the post-Mandelson era of politics? This era has certainly had a number of false starts.

[macgamer]

John McDonnell says he was on the GLC - and that if he could go back in time and do one thing, he would visit the 1980s and "assassinate Thatcher". The wisdom of such a statement really has to be questioned.

McDonnell has certainly pinned his colours to the mast, if we weren't already aware of what they were.

[Hennessy]

...rather than devolve into a bizzare anti-multicultarism, anti-gay Nick Griffin monologue. Which made no sense whatsoever. You think Abbott and Mandelson are political friends?

You strange little man.

She's managed to scrape through to get on the ballot paper you'll be pleased to know: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/politics/10275365.stm

David Miliband thinks she is "not tokenistic". I beg to differ in the extreme. It seems enough time has passed for people to forget that this is the same Diane Abbott who cheerfully signed up her child for an exclusive public school while proselytizing all the time about the broken comprehensive system and even having the gall to insult Tony Blair for sending his kids to a selective comp. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Abbo ... _education)
This and other gaffes have convinced me both of her insincerity and also her insipid opportunism and sense of entitlement, something she will carry with her if she's ever elected. Aside from these obvious failures she's also foolish and loudly outspoken on topics she has not the first idea about, such as her opposition to "blue-eyed Finnish nurses" coming to the UK because "they may have never met a black person before" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Abbo ... ish_nurses)

I thoroughly resent being compared to Nick Griffin (and anti-gay, to boot!), but my opposition to her as Labour Leader does have something to do with her being black. She is thoroughly "tokenistic" and not a serious candidate at all precisely because throughout her political career it is her race that has enabled her to say stupid things and avoid punishment, and allowed her to attack without fear of retribution. It has enabled her to easily worm her way back in through TV spots with Michael Portillo on This Week and be rehabilitated when she should have been condemned for her hypocrisy and easy rabble-rousing. Having played the race card to get where she is, and used it to maintain her position furthermore, she is too tainted by it to be Labour Leader. If we are to have top-level black politicians in this country let us not make the mistake of the USA and support them purely on the basis they are black (and in Diane's case female). Obama's election has given us a novice when we needed a pro, and although he has had the dignity never to play on his race personally others have been all to ready to do it for him, especially the idealistic and the young. Diane Abbott does not tick any boxes for leadership, although she may be popular, it will be for all the wrong reasons. She has already begun her campaign by complaining about all the "white males" in the race. Is this what you want Redcelt? Thoroughly divisive, a proven bigot, opportunist, fraudster and worst of all a massive hypocrite?

I look forward to the race anyway, any result that doesn't have the last name "Miliband" will probably see the party exiled back to the political wilderness for a few years.

[wild_quinine]

I thoroughly resent being compared to Nick Griffin (and anti-gay, to boot!), but my opposition to her as Labour Leader does have something to do with her being black. She is thoroughly "tokenistic" and not a serious candidate at all precisely because throughout her political career it is her race that has enabled her to say stupid things and avoid punishment, and allowed her to attack without fear of retribution.

This is an offensive and thoroughly stupid way to say that you dislike the fact that other people sometimes positively discriminate. If you're saying any more than that, then you're well over the edge of full-blown racism.

Listen, I dislike Sarah Palin. I dislike her because I think she's shallow, corrupt, and a bit dense. I also dislike the fact that some people are going to vote for her, wherever she goes, because she's a woman. But those are two separate things. I dislike positive discrimination. I dislike Sarah Palin.

But I don't dislike women, or Sarah Palin for being a woman, and if I ever started to feel like I did, then I would need to take a look at myself.

Obama's election has given us a novice when we needed a pro

Obama's still just a politician, and he's got terrible views on copyright. But generally speaking, I think he's grand.

I would have voted him in without batting an eyelid for the single reason that when he explains something I like what he says, I like how he puts it, and I tend to agree with his reasoning. Call me a pushover, but I respect someone who's not afraid to use an intelligent argument in front of an angry mob, and someone who can do that without getting ruffled or losing their cool pretty much has me rapt with awe.

Maybe I'm a sucker for charisma, but I don't recall being convinced by anyone nearly so much before.

Plus, there's none of this 'if you're not with us, you're against us' shit that had me throwing paperbacks at the TV for eight straight years.

[Hennessy]

I thoroughly resent being compared to Nick Griffin (and anti-gay, to boot!), but my opposition to her as Labour Leader does have something to do with her being black. She is thoroughly "tokenistic" and not a serious candidate at all precisely because throughout her political career it is her race that has enabled her to say stupid things and avoid punishment, and allowed her to attack without fear of retribution.

This is an offensive and thoroughly stupid way to say that you dislike the fact that other people sometimes positively discriminate. If you're saying any more than that, then you're well over the edge of full-blown racism.

Listen, I dislike Sarah Palin. I dislike her because I think she's shallow, corrupt, and a bit dense. I also dislike the fact that some people are going to vote for her, wherever she goes, because she's a woman. But those are two separate things. I dislike positive discrimination. I dislike Sarah Palin.

But I don't dislike women, or Sarah Palin for being a woman, and if I ever started to feel like I did, then I would need to take a look at myself.

Obama's election has given us a novice when we needed a pro

Obama's still just a politician, and he's got terrible views on copyright. But generally speaking, I think he's grand.

I would have voted him in without batting an eyelid for the single reason that when he explains something I like what he says, I like how he puts it, and I tend to agree with his reasoning. Call me a pushover, but I respect someone who's not afraid to use an intelligent argument in front of an angry mob, and someone who can do that without getting ruffled or losing their cool pretty much has me rapt with awe.

I was watching BBC news earlier during an interview with the newest contender for the Labour leadership when the newsreader asked her if she thought it was "patronising" that David Miliband had offered to vote for her. She of course said no, but that didn't hide the fact that it was an inherently patronising act. I can't quite work out what it is you've extrapolated from my post wild_quinine, but now I can add the accolades "thoroughly stupid" and "offensive" to "Nick Griffin" and "anti-gay". Have I been away from the sinner so long that it has been taken over by these malicious ad hominem attacks?

I dislike Diane Abbott on a number of levels, not because she is black but because she uses being black so shamelessly. That is my principal objection to her and I reserve the right to include a critique of her race, as that is exactly what everyone else will be doing when they consider her candidacy for the labour leadership, as Mr Miliband's sickeningly paternalistic approach to Ms Abbott's candidacy shows. My objection to Diane Abbott is not racist in my opinion, but it depends on how sensitive you wish to be. I think all factors should be considered when selecting a suitable leader.

As for Obama: Read the reviews man, he's got an approval rating that refuses to buck up past 50% and has even sunk as low as 42%. We may love him here in Europe for a variety of reasons, but it's becoming increasingly clear he's an unpopular and inexperienced President over there

[wild_quinine]

I can't quite work out what it is you've extrapolated from my post wild_quinine, but now I can add the accolades "thoroughly stupid" and "offensive" to "Nick Griffin" and "anti-gay".

I thought I explained it OK-ish, but I'll have another crack.

It's not racist to accept that race can play a part in things that happen in society, and in politics.

It's not racist to dislike a candidate.

It's not racist to dislike a candidate for using their race to advantage.

It's probably racist to suggest that's what a candidate is doing without good evidence. (Which you may have, I don't know the facts here).

It's definitely racist to blame someone for their race, or for any percieved effects their race has.

As such, when you say 'my opposition to her as Labour Leader does have something to do with her being black', then that is very badly put together, to give you the benefit of the doubt. I'm not sure if you're doing it for shock value or if you just don't see the distinction.

Now I should say that I'm not telling you that you *shouldn't* be offensive. Frankly, it makes life more interesting when some people are. I just thought you might like to know that's what I was getting out of what you wrote. Y'know, in case you pull that one out at your next dinner party or something.

Have I been away from the sinner so long that it has been taken over by these malicious ad hominem attacks?

That is not what 'ad hominem' is.

Also, probably.

I dislike Diane Abbott on a number of levels, not because she is black but because she uses being black so shamelessly.

Fine, if you can back it up.

That is my principal objection to her and I reserve the right to include a critique of her race

Another disturbingly poor choice of words.

My objection to Diane Abbott is not racist in my opinion, but it depends on how sensitive you wish to be.

I don't think of myself as the sensitive type, but I suppose I could be a bit overtuned these days.

I think all factors should be considered when selecting a suitable leader.

Really? Including if they're a woman? Or if they're Jewish? Or where their parents came from? Or if they once had a gay experience? Or if they're having one right now?

Really?

I mean, democracy, man. You can decide on that kind of a basis if you want. I can't tell you not to do that. But I sure hope you've got some kind of weighted ranking system going on there, or it's maybe going to come down to the age old boxers or briefs debate.

As for Obama: Read the reviews man, he's got an approval rating that refuses to buck up past 50% and has even sunk as low as 42%. We may love him here in Europe for a variety of reasons, but it's becoming increasingly clear he's an unpopular and inexperienced President over there

Finally, I'm backing the underdog again. I was starting to think the world had gone mad.

[macgamer]

Have I been away from the sinner so long that it has been taken over by these malicious ad hominem attacks?

It's The Sinner, I think its always be here. However it might have increased appreciably, but there are still many contributors that will hear people out.

As for Obama: Read the reviews man, he's got an approval rating that refuses to buck up past 50% and has even sunk as low as 42%. We may love him here in Europe for a variety of reasons, but it's becoming increasingly clear he's an unpopular and inexperienced President over there

One name: BP. He's really milking that for all its worth. The disaster has been a lifeline for his presidency. Very well timed, distracting the media and voters away from his lack lustre leadership.

[RedCelt69]

She's managed to scrape through to get on the ballot paper you'll be pleased to know: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/politics/10275365.stm

Very pleased to know, yes.

David Miliband thinks she is "not tokenistic". I beg to differ in the extreme. It seems enough time has passed for people to forget that this is the same Diane Abbott who cheerfully signed up her child for an exclusive public school while proselytizing all the time about the broken comprehensive system and even having the gall to insult Tony Blair for sending his kids to a selective comp.

The school thing is a shame... but I long-ago realised that expecting people to be saintly in all aspects is a forlorn wish. Would you like to take a look at the double-standards of David Cameron? Do you think he doesn't have double-standards - or has made politically embarassing statements?

I value Abbott's political views. Regardless of the colour of her skin. I guess I'm just more colour-blind than you are. She got the stint on This Week because she's black? Then what skin-coloured definition enabled Portillo's slot? Oh, wait... that had nothing to do with skin colour... <sigh>

Abbott and Portillo (who's on 1st base?) were ideal candidates for the show because neither of them are at the beck and call of party whips. Abbott is a committed non-Blairite and non-Brownite. Portillo is an ex-MP. Both of them can offer political commentary without worrying about a career-damaging statement if their personal opinion differs from the mandatory party line.

She has already begun her campaign by complaining about all the "white males" in the race. Is this what you want Redcelt? Thoroughly divisive, a proven bigot, opportunist, fraudster and worst of all a massive hypocrite?

Lots of people have commented upon the one-race/one-gender nature of the leadership contest. Not just black people. Not just women. Not just Dianne Abbot.

But when she does it, that matters more. What with her being black, yeah?

Wild_Quinine has already addressed your overuse of race, so I won't elaborate. But you really shouldn't complain too loudly about your anti-multiculturalism rant being mistaken for a Nick Griffin moment. On that matter, you and he would agree wholeheartedly. He also thinks that gays kissing is "creepy" so your Mandelson=pink vitriol would also pluck one of Griffin's heart strings.

Have I been away from the sinner so long that it has been taken over by these malicious ad hominem attacks?

I'm sure that this discussion has been had on The Sinner before, but you really need to learn what ad hominem is before using it in an accusation. An ad hominem is to attack the person instead of their position - not as well as their position.

As for Obama: Read the reviews man, he's got an approval rating that refuses to buck up past 50% and has even sunk as low as 42%. We may love him here in Europe for a variety of reasons, but it's becoming increasingly clear he's an unpopular and inexperienced President over there

One name: BP. He's really milking that for all its worth. The disaster has been a lifeline for his presidency. Very well timed, distracting the media and voters away from his lack lustre leadership.

Uhm... firstly, Obama is taking political hits due to BP. It is a hindrance, not a help.

As for his popularity.

The USA is freshly-warm in the aftermath of the Cold War. During the Cold War, everything even remotely Communistic was painted as an evil beyond all evils. Obama's health plans are painted as Socialism (Communism)... and a few generations' worth of Red-hating Americans portray Obama's attempts at repairing the USA's broken healthcare system as an avowal worthy of nothing other than a Soviet decree.

Stupid people hate sensible things. Especially when it's been brainwashed into them (and their parents) from McCarthy onwards.

[DACrowe]

Obama's health plans are painted as Socialism (Communism)... and a few generations' worth of Red-hating Americans portray Obama's attempts at repairing the USA's broken healthcare system as an avowal worthy of nothing other than a Soviet decree.

Which is proof, as if proof were needed, that the Republicans have given up on actual republican politics as they're attacking him with the charge of 'socialism' not for a single-payer system like the Democrats hoped to bring in but for what he was eventually beaten down to; a package of minor reforms to the private health insurance business which had previously been proposed by Republicans (Romney and McCain amongst them). Republicanism-with-a-small r assumes at least that the representatives are going to be forthright and honest in their disputations and that if they aren't the checks in the system such as the press will expose them. It's not the American healthcare system that's broken; it's the American political system; the healthcare system is just a symptom.

The USA is freshly-warm in the aftermath of the Cold War. During the Cold War, everything even remotely Communistic was painted as an evil beyond all evils.

It occurs to me that the Republican's exploitation of the pre-existing memetic structure concerning the red menace bears an ironic resemblance to Stalin's exploitation of the memes left over by Tsarism and the Orthodox Church during the Great Patriotic War.

[Hennessy]

I value Abbott's political views. Regardless of the colour of her skin. I guess I'm just more colour-blind than you are. She got the stint on This Week because she's black? Then what skin-coloured definition enabled Portillo's slot? Oh, wait... that had nothing to do with skin colour... <sigh>

Could you outline what her policies for the labour leadership are? As a candidate she should have some prominent ideas about where she wants Labour to go, surely? She has been in the race for some time now.

She has already begun her campaign by complaining about all the "white males" in the race. Is this what you want Redcelt? Thoroughly divisive, a proven bigot, opportunist, fraudster and worst of all a massive hypocrite?
Lots of people have commented upon the one-race/one-gender nature of the leadership contest. Not just black people. Not just women. Not just Dianne Abbot.

I don't think anyone besides a few guardianistas went as far as to declare that the race was "too white" before Abbott opened her mouth

But when she does it, that matters more. What with her being black, yeah?

It kind of does. You see, as I outlined in an earlier post, she has a bit of a problem with shooting her mouth off about white people, coming from Hackney I can see why she rarely meets many. Her inability to keep her mouth shut about all the white oppressors she might meet while labour leader is what worries me, personally. Although realistically I should be her biggest supporter. If she's elected it'll be back to the political wilderness for Labour.

Wild_Quinine has already addressed your overuse of race, so I won't elaborate. But you really shouldn't complain too loudly about your anti-multiculturalism rant being mistaken for a Nick Griffin moment. On that matter, you and he would agree wholeheartedly. He also thinks that gays kissing is "creepy" so your Mandelson=pink vitriol would also pluck one of Griffin's heart strings.

It appears this statement has been misinterpreted. I meant "pink" as in female/woman/feminist and meant to attach it to Diane Abbott. I did wonder why I had been labelled anti-gay. Mandelson being high vizier during Brown's premiership I could just imagine his inner delight that a Labour Leader might be elected who could reproduce the "Obama effect" on a grateful nation. But you're right, even he considers Abbott too batshit hard left to do anything but paint a big target on herself and the Labour party.

The USA is freshly-warm in the aftermath of the Cold War. During the Cold War, everything even remotely Communistic was painted as an evil beyond all evils. Obama's health plans are painted as Socialism (Communism)... and a few generations' worth of Red-hating Americans portray Obama's attempts at repairing the USA's broken healthcare system as an avowal worthy of nothing other than a Soviet decree.

Stupid people hate sensible things. Especially when it's been brainwashed into them (and their parents) from McCarthy onwards.

You've accused me of bizzare monologues, amigo, but I can't resist this little gem. The cold war was over 20 years ago, and McCarthy was around 50-60 years ago. I personally would argue that the USA's economic history, general suspicion of the government and emphasis on the individual has more to do with opposition to universal health care than the hunt for red spies leaving microfilm in pumpkins in Arkansas. You undervalue the average American's intelligence when you say they can't tell the difference between communism and socialism. They can come over here and see socialism, or go to pretty much any Western European nation for social democracy. They don't have to like it, however.

[jollytiddlywink]

You've accused me of bizzare monologues, amigo, but I can't resist this little gem. The cold war was over 20 years ago, and McCarthy was around 50-60 years ago. I personally would argue that the USA's economic history, general suspicion of the government and emphasis on the individual has more to do with opposition to universal health care than the hunt for red spies leaving microfilm in pumpkins in Arkansas. You undervalue the average American's intelligence when you say they can't tell the difference between communism and socialism. They can come over here and see socialism, or go to pretty much any Western European nation for social democracy. They don't have to like it, however.

Well done, you know two approximate dates. You can argue about what you think is the cause of the use of socialism as a pejorative term in American political discourse, especially by commentators on the right, but suggesting that "past form" has nothing to do with the way the US reacts to the term now is nonsense. Would you suggest that the Second World War has no influence on how most British people see the BNP, or would you argue that our political history, suspicion of extreme politics and emphasis on being too polite to kick out all the foreigners has more to do with opposition to the BNP than the fact that they are a bit reminiscent of fascists?
As for your optimistic assertion about the political awareness of the average American, I feel compelled to assert that many, probably most, Americans cannot tell the difference between communism and socialism. Indeed a large minority of them will be unaware that there is a difference. To suggest that they can come over here and see socialism or social democracy is overly optimistic, too. About 10% of them have passports. The rest of them don't leave. Even some that come over here seem astonished to discover that we have things like the NHS. Two years ago I had a discussion with a JSA, who had at that point been here for nearly two months, in which it transpired that he was unaware that Britain had universal, government funded healthcare. He was astounded that this was, in fact, the case. He then spent the rest of the conversation arguing right up the edge of, but not quite saying, that poor people should just get on with it and die.
"They don't have to like it, however." Indeed they don't, but often they don't know anything about what they so fervently despise.

[RedCelt69]

[LonelyPilgrim]

As for Obama: Read the reviews man, he's got an approval rating that refuses to buck up past 50% and has even sunk as low as 42%. We may love him here in Europe for a variety of reasons, but it's becoming increasingly clear he's an unpopular and inexperienced President over there

42% approval is actually doing quite well for an American president, by the by. Consider that Bush spent some time in the teens, and we've had precious few presidents with their approval over 50% by the end of their first term (Eisenhower managed it, but then plummeted during his second term).

One name: BP. He's really milking that for all its worth. The disaster has been a lifeline for his presidency. Very well timed, distracting the media and voters away from his lack lustre leadership.

What universe are you living in? Obama is taking a beating on the cable news and in some print outlets because the problem isn't sorted yet. We're an impatient bunch, us Americans. The Right is baying for Obama's blood because the oil is still spilling and because we haven't nuked BP headquarters or some other nonsense that a 'real leader' would do. This sort of criticism is what led Obama to utter his statement that he's conferring with experts to 'know whose ass to kick' last week. That in turn has hurt him because now he's being attacked for using language unbecoming the decorum of the presidency.

The BP spill is a political disaster for the Obama administration, just like any large disaster is for any incumbent administration. Since it now looks like it could be late August before the spill is definitively stopped, the pressure on Obama to 'do something' will only grow between now and then, creating the ridiculous expectation that there is something he *can* do, and then when he fails to do the impossible, it will be spun to look just as bad (if not worse) than the Bush response to Katrina. Fundamentally this is because, "Look, there's nothing we can do," might be be an honest response to criticism, but it isn't a very compelling one.

[LonelyPilgrim]

You've accused me of bizzare monologues, amigo, but I can't resist this little gem. The cold war was over 20 years ago, and McCarthy was around 50-60 years ago. I personally would argue that the USA's economic history, general suspicion of the government and emphasis on the individual has more to do with opposition to universal health care than the hunt for red spies leaving microfilm in pumpkins in Arkansas. You undervalue the average American's intelligence when you say they can't tell the difference between communism and socialism. They can come over here and see socialism, or go to pretty much any Western European nation for social democracy. They don't have to like it, however.

Communism and socialism are the same thing in the American political lexicon: have been since the 1920's, at least. I only have to go into my local coffeeshop to confront signs declaring that the Communist Party of Satan has stolen the country. And right next to that gem is one with the face of Ronald Reagan smiling down from the clouds with a halo around his head and the legend: "We miss you Ron!"

I really wish I could say that the couple that owns said coffeeshop were the lunatic fringe, but unfortunately as lunatic as they are they aren't anywhere near the fringe.

What really gets me is how the Right has portrayed Obama as a Socialist/Commie, but they've also made liberal use of his face photo-shopped onto Hitler, complete with moustache. Depending on which commentators you listen to or read, he's either a communist or a fascist, or I've even heard the phrase 'communo-fascist' a few times. Which makes absolutely no sense, but this is America, we do things our own way.

I almost pulled over and crashed a Tea Party rally a couple months ago as I noticed how many of the attendees were wearing swastika armbands. I really was tempted to march up to one of them, rip off the band, and harangue the crowd, but my better judgement decided that anyone whose gone so far off the deep end to wear that symbol while 'standing up for democracy' is probably only a half-step away from 'murderous mob activity.'

All of which goes to the point that the average American has no idea what terms like 'communism', 'socialism', and 'fascism' actually mean. They know they are BAD THINGS and that communism and socialism go with liberalism and progressives and have something to do with government getting bigger and taking stuff over. As for calling Obama a fascist... I think the Left used the term too much in referring to Bush, and it's lost any sort of meaning other than being 'a bad word to call a president you don't like,' now. Hence you get Communo-Fascist.

We're well down the rabbit hole over here.