Food, drink & other things in the library

[CheeseDaddy]

Far and away the most irritating thing about trying to work in the library is neither music nor people eating, its the sound of someone with a cold who feels the need to sniff every 20-30 seconds, with this repetitive beat enhanced by occasional bouts of coughing and/or sneezes at irregular intervals. Please, please if you have a cold STAY AT HOME!

[starsandsparkles]

As for those of you who took objection to the OP's point, would it be safe to assume that you have all shown a similar lack of consideration to others? In the library or otherwise?

I can't recall a time I've taken my ipod to the library, I take my library books back on time as far as humanly possible, I have never answered my phone in the library and always make sure it's on silent, and if someone talks to me I get embarrassed and whisper in reply, trying to make the conversation as short as possible.

There are annoying people in the library, but I tend to find that my annoyance with them is related to my stress levels. The more stressed I am, the more annoyed I get, which is really not good for working and so I leave and go somewhere else.

It was the way the OP posted that I objected to, not the actual comments they had to make.

Edit: Yes to the most annoying people being people with colds! I have work to do too, I don't need catching your illness making it anymore difficult, thank you.

[Freaker]

1 - The number of times OP uses the word 'rules' scares me. "I am right because the rules are on my side" may be valid, but really makes you look like quite narrow-minded. Arguably, socially there is nothing wrong with breaking a number of rules if the right the rule protects is not violated or there are no other negative consequences - nothing wrong with talking normally as you leave the library at 23.58 indeed. One needs to be careful not to let this descend to "you can break any rule as long as nobody is harmed", but I think with library rules of the kind we are discussing we are on fairly safe terrain.

By all means, I hate it when people listen to music so loudly that I can hear it, and I will ask them to turn it down. But use that to say that nobody is allowed to listen to music, even those who listen to it so quietly nobody else has ever heard it? I don't think so.

The problem with somebody else listening to loud music is that it is disturbing to others, and only secondarily, that they are breaking a rule. I'd agree with you if you ranted about people listening to music too loudly and said that it was not fair on others needing quiet - but, as said, justifying your point with reference to the rules and blind adherence to them rather than common sense makes it sound narrow-minded and self-righteous, when else it would just sound reasonable.

2 - There seems to be some misunderstanding of what the university computers are for. They are provided by the library for student use. Nowhere does it say that they are provided for work only, in fact, on visiting day tours, prospective students are told that they do not have to bring their own computer, because there are plenty available. Bit nasty to deny people not having personal computers normal non-work related internet access. There'd be no point in having set up the express computers, either, if they were solely for work - bit uncomfortable writing an essay standing up.

You wait for a computer and get one, then are free to use it for as long as you need and want to. Only on some computers there are special facilities that give people wanting to use them priority (eg scanners) - other than that, I have to say that wait times have actually gone down a lot. I now hardly ever have to wait, and if so no more than a minute or two, compared to long lines of 20 or more people in my first year...


PS: This thread reminds me nicely of the new security guard at the front, who seems to agree with OP for a strict interpretation of the rules, most noticeable when very loudly asking people on cell phones to leave, confiscating drinks or calling the ominous "come back please" in a particularly unhappy-sounding way. Funnily enough, he also likes to have loud conversations with other people at his little desk, much louder than most people answer their cell phones on their way outside...

[Delts]

Damn, I apparently have a vagina, how did I never know? I must find where and utilise it!

[Zanbato]

Surely a bit of come and go with each other is the answer? The middle ground of not making too much noise seems like the normal situaion to me. I use the library enough, and such islands of irritation are far apart. You make it sound like this happens to you all the time; maybe it does.

I sympathise with the need for quiet, but I have to say that I find it hard to work in complete silence. I even have a "clicker" keyboard on my pc because I like some noise - as long as its below a certain level.

I hate to say it, but you sound like you'd just be irate at some other source of noise anyway; photocopiers, people shelving books, electrical equipment making a hum, cars driving outside etc. If you need absolute silence, then get ear defenders or, I dunno, go deaf. Otherwise, do as suggested and work harder on cencentrating. If I can blank people talking directly to me whilst working, then i'm sure you can blank out some whispering or people drinking.

As for the pc issue; They are there to be used, for a myriad of purposes. It doesnt matter if its work or not; they might be taking a break from work to check emails. Who cares, it's their right to do so. Theres enough of them, i'm sure waiting for 5 minutes to use one is not such a big deal.

[zipporah]

I usually find the hum of the computers more offputting than anything else in the library. If someone's bothering you so much you can't work, say something, or ask the library staff to. I've only really witnessed a few instances that I thought were a bit too much, like the girl who brought a hot, pungent takeaway into the library to eat. That kind of things rather amazes me because it's such a blatent breaking of rules.

My friend told me it's impossible to read in St Mary's because the students all know each other and treat it like a common room, and this does seem to be true. I was checking my email after grabbing a short loan book, and a guy started talking to a girl who'd come in after me. Not leaning over, quiet talking like I'd expect in an otherwise silent room. Loud, enthusiastic talking and guffawing, as if they were outside. That just ... baffles me. People are working. Shut up.

[Hennessy]

I do remember sitting next to someone who was being arsey the other day, a huge fat girl with glasses who obviously hadn't finished her essay before the due day and yet to my surprise spent most of her time squeezing out of her chair and walking around telling others to be quiet, before ploppingher grand-piano sized arse back down on her chair and carrying on. The spectacle convinced me of the need for tolerance in the library.

The punchline, redcelt, not surprised you and the library user were the only ones who missed it, or indeed cared enough to comment on the rest of that passage.

And I was in the library today, the place seems to function perfectly well for it's primary purpose, which is the reference and loan of books in an organised environment. Working or playing on computers won't ever be the primary purpose of the library, fortunately.

[RedCelt69]

Jokes have punchlines. Wherein lay the "joke"?

[irish200]

Edit: Yes to the most annoying people being people with colds! I have work to do too, I don't need catching your illness making it anymore difficult, thank you.

Great, why don't we just get some police officers to stand at the door and disallow entry to anyone who dares to sneeze or cough. Ill people need to study too. Deal with it.

Edit: Attributed to the correct person. Just a minor bit of poor editing, don't get your knickers in a twist RedCelt.

[RedCelt69]

Way to misattribute! I didn't say that.

[LonelyPilgrim]

Dear sweet [insert deity or comical figure of your preference here]! Who knew people could get so testy about such an esoteric subject as library etiquette. Please, let me give my two cents, seeing as I practically live in libraries in *gasp* the real world!

First, libraries are meant to be quiet. They are NOT meant to be SILENT. For one thing, people have to move, shuffle about, open and close books, talk to the librarians, or even talk to each other if researching together. That said, noise should be kept to a minimum and listening to music is just plain ridiculous. Which leads me to my second point: I quite like to work to music myself. I crank up my music at home and really get cracking, occassionally getting up from my desk and dancing a bit when I need a movement break. Sometimes I even sing along. THAT SAID, you really shouldn't listen to music in the library or any other place where other people are studying/working unless you know they won't mind. If you really NEED music to concentrate on your work, you are mentally deficient. Yes, I said it. You've obviously trained yourself to be that way, and you need to get to work on correcting it, because you're going to run into problems in the workplace in the REAL WORLD if you can't work without your tunes.

ON THE OTHER HAND, you are just as screwed in the real world if you need absolute silence to concentrate on your work. Generally speaking, work environments aren't quiet. People call you. People lean on your desk and talk to you. The idiot who sucks up to the manager so he can break the rules DOES listen to his tunes at work in the next cubicle over, loudly - and if you complain too much you can forget about your annual raise. Etc. Etc. Unless of course, like me, you primarily do research in libraries. But then again, like I said above libraries aren't meant to be totally silent.

The point is, if you can't just ignore what's going on around you or isn't going on around you then the powers of concentration and focus that you currently possess are deficient. Both camps should be a little more concerned about that than about arguing over who has the moral high ground. So, OP, yes, it really sucks that inconsiderate people break the library rules, but I have a news flash for you: most people are inconsiderate, at least some of the time. It's a fact of life and if you can't learn to deal with it, I give you five years before you're locked in a rubber room somewhere eating soft food with your hands, because they won't trust you with a spoon after where you put the last one, and talking to your imaginary third foot.

And for all you self-centered, egotistical, morally relativist twats who think your own comfort is more important than consideration for others: Just wait until you're getting on in years and young folk who are the age you are now show you as much respect as you show others... I'll be laughing. On the inside, though, since laughing out loud would be insensitive and rude (and distracting).

[Eiken]

If you really NEED music to concentrate on your work, you are mentally deficient. Yes, I said it. You've obviously trained yourself to be that way, and you need to get to work on correcting it, because you're going to run into problems in the workplace in the REAL WORLD if you can't work without your tunes.

I accept your argument, but what about people, like myself, who CHOOSE to listen to music whilst working to block out other distractions?
It's not a necessity, it's a choice.
I don't have to listen to music, but I choose to most of the time, as it can help me pass the time.
Does that still make me "mentally deficient?"

[Delts]

Yay, apparently I'm mentally deficient. That could explain me not knowing that I had a vagina with sand in it.

This thread is ridiculous and should die. And for half the stuff said about the rules blah de blah. If a student comes up and bitches at me then they are almost guaranteed to get the finger.

Yes, I am a selfish prick at times and the library should be for me and me alone!


Actually, I'm now tempted to go to the library, log on to 5 or 6 computers, crash them (easy to do thanks to firefox ) and let them get to the point where only admins or I can undo the damage and let other users on, just because I am /that/ big a prick.

[disclaimer] Even I'm not sure how serious I've been in the above posts.[/disclaimer]

[Mehmsy]

After reading this, I'm going to find the most obnoxious, arsey-looking rule-abiding pedant in the library, sit next to them and break all of those rules with passion.

To be frank, if you're so uptight about studying, do it at home.

[starsandsparkles]

Great, why don't we just get some police officers to stand at the door and disallow entry to anyone who dares to sneeze or cough. Ill people need to study too. Deal with it.

Edit: Attributed to the correct person. Just a minor bit of poor editing, don't get your knickers in a twist RedCelt.

I'm not talking about the occassional sneeze or cough, but when someone is sitting there clearly sniffling and ill it becomes an issue. If people who listen to music are inconsiderate, then ill people working in the library are even more so.

Many people in the working world complain about colleagues coming in sick too. It's not limited to the library.

I wasn't suggesting that ill people don't need to work. As someone often ill, I am well aware of this. However, I wouldn't sit in the library and inflict my illness on others. Grab your books and go home.

[mcg23]

i just hiccuped in the library. twice.

[irish200]

Great, why don't we just get some police officers to stand at the door and disallow entry to anyone who dares to sneeze or cough. Ill people need to study too. Deal with it.

Edit: Attributed to the correct person. Just a minor bit of poor editing, don't get your knickers in a twist RedCelt.

I'm not talking about the occassional sneeze or cough, but when someone is sitting there clearly sniffling and ill it becomes an issue. If people who listen to music are inconsiderate, then ill people working in the library are even more so.

Many people in the working world complain about colleagues coming in sick too. It's not limited to the library.

I wasn't suggesting that ill people don't need to work. As someone often ill, I am well aware of this. However, I wouldn't sit in the library and inflict my illness on others. Grab your books and go home.

That is to once again assume that the person who is ill can go home to a quiet flat or whatever and work. They have as much right as you to be in the library, regardless of them being ill or not. It is stupid to say that ill people are more inconsiderate than people that listen to music. People make a conscious decision to play music, but they have no say in catching a cold. They cannot help it and I fail to see why they should be punished for something they have no control over.

People complain about sick people in the working world? Gasp! Sorry, but you and I know for a fact that if you needed the money badly you would be in at work regardless of your health, the same applies to people who take their University work seriously, they get on with it regardless and this is something to be respected rather than moaned about. The person who is ill does not lose their right to go to work or enter a library. To punish people on the basis of being ill is plain ridiculous.

[munchingfoo]

I have had sinusitis since January. It's basically like having a constant cold but without any of the contagion. Should I have been banned from the library for a year of my studies? What about people with disabilities? It annoys me when people who can't walk properly shuffle along the floor like the hunchback of notre dame bumping into the occasional shelf. Maybe we should ban disabled people too.

Don't get me started on electric wheelchairs!!!

[starsandsparkles]

I have had sinusitis since January. It's basically like having a constant cold but without any of the contagion. Should I have been banned from the library for a year of my studies? What about people with disabilities? It annoys me when people who can't walk properly shuffle along the floor like the hunchback of notre dame bumping into the occasional shelf. Maybe we should ban disabled people too.

Don't get me started on electric wheelchairs!!!

I'm pretty sure disabilities aren't contagious

It is stupid to say that ill people are more inconsiderate than people that listen to music. People make a conscious decision to play music, but they have no say in catching a cold. They cannot help it and I fail to see why they should be punished for something they have no control over.

People playing music affects those surrounding you for as long as that person is working in the library. You sitting there passing your cold arounds affects those surrounding you for as long as it takes for all those people you've given your cold to to get rid of it.

As someone who caught a cold last semester in February, and ended up in hospital in May because of it, nearly missing exams and having to revise in hospital, it isn't a case of a few hours or days. I avoid the library because of this, thus I am being "punished" because you can't keep your cold at home for three days.

[irish200]

I differenciated between circumstances within your control (music) and outisde them (illness), you seem to have failed to acknowledge the distinction. You could catch a cold from anywhere at any time from anyone you happen to stand near in a queue, bump into on the way to a class or whatever. People not going to the library because of illness is certainly going to do nothing to stop you catching other peoples illnesses. As far as your argument goes it is too easy to apply what you are saying to a multitude of situations.

Those who frequent a Coffee Shop or Supermarket are endlessly faced with line upon line of sniffing diseased people. What do you suggest we do in these situation, close the shops to the ill too? , do they have no right to do their shopping or buy a drink because they could pass something on in exactly the same way they might do sitting in the library?. I have been ill in the past and missed classes and exams because of it, but I'm not going to complain that people sitting innocently doing their work in the library, a place of study open to all, should be cast out because they could infect me. Why don't we set up a colony and send all the ill students there, far away from us superior healthy specimins. People catch colds, get ill etc all the time, if you cant deal with being around people who are ill then I suggest you look more closely at your daily life and consider the countless times you could be 'infected' by fellow students. In a lecture, tutorial, or suchlike, these places are filled with germs and are much more likely places for you to catch any illness than the library. Maybe we should stop meeting altogether and conduct classes etc via the Internet so we wont pass on our germs, why don't we just cancel out the need for interaction altogether because you can't accept that there will always be ill people, wherever you look, and just get on with it.